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Trying to hold back the California High Speed Rail Authority is much akin to trying to stop illegal immigration. It ain’t going to happen…anytime soon! High Speed Rail is coming…….. brother!
The distance from Sacramento to San Diego is approximately 505 miles. Based on the fact that time was running out to spend the Federal money, the CHSRA selected an open area of the Central Valley from the tiny town of Borden to Corcoran…a first span of 65 miles – as the opening shot to create a leg of High Speed Rail.
Now you have to understand…this building program will include the tracks, station platforms and viaducts that elevate the line through urban areas and right-aways. This initial section however doesn’t include much in the way of High Speed infrastructure, like maintanence facilities, locomotives, passenger cars or the electrical system necessary to power high-speed trains.
As can be imagined, the Central Valley politicians are just “scrambling”, trying to figure out why they didn’t get the selected 65 mile stretch, or when more of that program will be unveiled. Stockton Mayor Ann Johnston…loved the idea, Merced Mayor Bill Spriggs voiced concern that his community wouldn’t profit initially. Vice Chairman of the CHSRA Tom Umberg filled in for CHSRA Chairman Curt Pringle….who was absent on the day of he vote. Evidently, Curt didn’t want to have folks say…he rammed the project through.
Congressman Dennis Cardoza of Merced….called it “the train to nowhere”….which isn’t exactly the case. The CHSRA has already said that the track could be used by Amtrak, in a worse case senario. The truth of the matter is: “There’s a lot of money….in High Speed Rail….lots of jobs and a good end benefit – connecting Northern California to Southern California.” Mayor Bob Link of Visalia: ” This is not a train to nowhere.” “Fresno is one of the largest cities in California!” Needless to say, the bureaucrats and elected are just giddy….thinking about all the jobs and the coming increases to their local economies.
“The Central Valley was chosen as a starting point to rapidly create jobs and avoid the expected resistance in Los Angeles and San Francisco.” said Rob Kulat, a Federal Railroad Administration spokesperson.
Hey, by the time they get done….it may cost realistically upwards of a $100 Billion dollars for California High Speed Rail. That’s a lot of construction, lots of jobs and an interesting time ahead for us all in the Golden State. For those that oppose the California High Speed Rail Authority and the program in general, they will be facing a well organized, highly funded, movtivated group of citizens, bureaucrats, electeds and workers that want their communities to prosper with a High Speed Rail future.
How long will all this take? It will be interesting to see how long the first stretch takes to complete! This just maybe one of those “shovel ready projects” – that will move quickly ahead. We will be watching! Hey, when you spend $4.15 billion dollars to kick start the project…how bad can it be?
*There is an excellent article today in the LA Times…..in the LATEXTRA Section…by Dan Weikel and Rich Connell
Trains are the biggest waste of money. You can’t rely on them. I have tried the train to San Diego only to have the trip interrupted by maintenance, eathquake, fire, flood. Everytime I try ot ride the train they have an issue. Cal Poly San Luis Obispo said students can take the train because they are just so convenient. It is not. The train sells out. My daughter was forced to endure harassment at LA’s Union Station and rude station reps. in Santa Barbara and hassels with over charges on her credit card by Amtrak. So she has her car now. No American should have to endure government trains.
Andy you have rotten train luck. I take it all the time. There are delays about as often as you’d get with any other transportation. And why would high-speed rail be exactly like Amtrak anyway?
I take the trains all the time, when I can.
The government should only be involved in rebuilding the railway corridors, just like the interstate freeways. Then just like the freeways and airports, private businesses would supply the various type of railcars, etc.
If you look at the California high speed rail alignment, it requires a total rebuild of the current rail alignment in a way to maximize cost and provide for the least useful utility in a railway corridor.
If it was up to me, I would use 2/3’s of the dollars to build a new corridor along a currently non-used or under used right of way, then shift the rail traffic to the new corridor and use the 1/3 of the dollars to rebuild the current corridor without disruption of service.
“For those that oppose the California High Speed Rail Authority and the program in general, they will be facing a well organized, highly funded, movtivated group of citizens, bureaucrats, electeds and workers that want their communities to prosper with a High Speed Rail future.”
And you’re cheerleading this small clique of collection of self-interested people who are working the power of government for their own purposes? And everybody else picks up the tab?
Ron & Anna.
Show me the money. While voters approved a $9 billion Ballot Measure calling for an 800 mile high speed rail system that would reach from San Diego to Sacramento, the media continues to call it a $43 billion 400 mile project from Anaheim to SF. There is a second phase to this bogus 200 mph pipe dream.
So we have your president priming the pump with $2.25 billion yet no one addresses the simple fact that this eventual $85 billion 3 P, aka public-private-public partnership is not to have any subsidy and that no section of track is to be laid until the funds are in a lock box get’s lost in this ongoing debate.
Note: The above quoted $85 billion is not from my imagination. It is from the Reason Foundation project evaluation.
So to is the yet to be issued statewide Bonds that when added together will add a few billion dollars in debt service to our yearly budget taking those precious funds away from little things like education and public safety.
And for anyone to believe that a venture capitalist will invest billions of dollars in a project that does not yield a reasonable ROI for its investors you must be dreaming.
According to published reports the intial cost of a ticket vs. air travel has gone up while the ridership numbers have declined. A great beginning.
*Dr. Gilbert, led astray again……oh my…the veracity of the Reason Foundation…no less?
Aren’t these the very same folks that want to charge us all…for every mile driven on their
so-called “Toll Motor Ways”…just like in England?
The realities are simple….if you don’t get part of the cash…there is “very little reason” to
endorse “any project” at all.
The truth of the matter is that “someone” will be getting about 80,000 new jobs to create
this expansion bridge to the moon. It really doesn’t matter where or how long the HSR
venture will go or take……it is circulating new cash into California…and lord knows we
need it despartely.
rw
Oh no! A corrupt little cabal of 80,000 blue collar workers! Alert the Fringers!
Out of a state with 40,000,000 people? Yeah, that’s pretty little. But of course the trades unions carry a lot of weight up in Sacto, so by the time they’re done buying votes it will be totally corrupt (well, it’s already totally corrupt, so that’s not quite right).
80,000 new good paying jobs, each of these guys or gals helping support an average family of 4, contributing to the economy, buying stuff, paying taxes, leading to more jobs. It’s worth getting excited about even if you’re not a union member.
In other words: more government stimulus with newly printed money and forget whether or not anybody needs this boondoggle . That’s where we part company, amigo.
We don’t need this? California does need this new transportation, the world needs to get away from oil-guzzling airplanes and cars, AND we need the jobs.
There’s a lot of other ancillary benefits too. For one thing, once California companies start making the train cars and infrastructure, other states and countries will come knocking at our door, amigo.
Vern.
The debate is not about unions. Sure, Siemens will produce those cars in the USA. So they claim to get your support. I wonder what percentage of the parts will come from other countries and states.
You have yet to answer my basic question. If high speed rail was the silver bullet to save the planet from global warming and to get us out of our cars why hasn’t Al Gore offered to fund our $85 billion system??
He could than charge whatever he feels the market will bear without the need for public assistance, money that we simply do not have laying around.
Tony.
It would require extensive text to spell out the flaws in the HSR.
One example is that they compare the cost of an airline ticket or vehicle fuel costs for todays’ commuters in establishing possible ticket costs yet fail to take into account that many people who drive are in car pools. Others taking longer trips to the bay area from southern CA often have one or more passengers in their vehicles.
If you look at the projected map of stops along the trip there is no way that this train will average 220 MPH. From SAC to SD they are talking about 16 stops. From SF to SD it is 17 stops.
We rode the Shanghai Pudong maglev in China two years ago reaching a top speed of 268 MPH. That was a non stop train that only covered 20 miles of flat terrain. Yet we are sold a bill of goods that our HSR will travel at 220 MPH. Maybe a single non stop test run but as of today that is not a safe speed for this technology.
Another flaw relates to your projected resident number of 40 million which is a valid projection. Ask yourself how many of us will ever take that trip from San Diego to Sacramento or San Francisco every year, month or day.
This is really about business people going from Curt Pringle’s ARTIC in Anaheim to LA. That train will not save you as much time as you might expect. I also question the speed when you consider the stops to pick up and discharge passengers. That train begins in Irvine and only stops in Anaheim, and Norwalk as it goes to Union Station in LA. So we will still need to commute from our homes to one of these two stations for the short trip to LA.
Let’s get the feel good out of the equation. I’ve done it in England, Mainland Europe and China. While its a fun experience how often will most of the 40 million californians use this government promoted transit alternative to get us out of our cars to control another aspect of our lives.
Its bad enough that they want to eliminate the burbs by mandating mixed use housing projects adjacent to train tracks.
Watch out. Pretty soon we will not be allowed to purchase more than one donut [doughnut]or bagel at the local coffee shop on your way to the office.
Brother Vern, Ron and Anna.
Whose “new cash” will be used to pay for this project and the 10,000’s of thousands of newly created jobs? Yours? Mine?
The federal government does not produce anything other than legislation seeking ways to simply increase taxes.
Let me suggest that anyone commenting on this post check out the specifics of the state documentation related to CA HSR.
At halftime during last night’s Mission Viejo game against Mater Dei I spotted Cornelius Vanderbilt. His security was so tight I was unable to speak to him about funding this newest form of rail transit. He of all people had the resources to make this investment
*George Soros, Warren Buffett, Bill and Melinda Gates……who else? They have these
incredible guilt feelings for ripping people off too much. But that’s OK….at least they are
trying to give back a little. Too many Rockefellers and others….never did and never will.
The little train that could……will bring some needed circular flow of cash so that various
cleaners, restaurants and hair cutters can pay their rent too. Who knows, maybe even
a few pairs of American Made Work Boots too! In any event, “Where the money comes
from…..will depend on “whose Pension OX gets gored?” CALSTRS, CALPERS and a whole raft of Goldman-Sachs execs….will be funding High Speed Rail Bonds…..left and right.
rw
Ron & Anna.
This post is not about Social Security benefits.
What I am asking is for the readers and author to focus on the cost factor.
You can’t simply wish upon a star and expect manna to fall from heaven to fund this project.
We do not go into debt simply because we want something new. That’s our personal philosophy.
What is lost in this continuous discussion is simply vote approval of more bonds like a reckless credit card user and let the next generation pay for it over the next 30 years at double or triple the original sum as we experience with redevelopment debt.
Folks. The CAHSR must have outside money. The $9 billion dollars that voters approved in 2008 will not get you from Newport Beach to Coalinga.
To repeat. Put the money in a box before moving ahead.
Kurt Pringle went to France and Germany to lobby for good paying American jobs? Can anyone say “made in China?”
P.S. The HSR was never meant to get anybody out of their cars and it won’t even if any track is ever laid.
*Hitchin a ride……now that’s cheap transportation. Just stick out your thumb, say a 1000 prayers and make sure you are not wearing skirt. You can get through LA from Orange County to Ventura…in about 24 hours….unless of course the CHP or local Cops don’t pick you up and detain you.
HSR….should be affordable. HSR should be reliable. HSR should be safe both technologically and physically. Whether you are traveling 20 miles or 500…..stepping into the 21st Century is probably a valuable contribution to society.
If Ben Bernanke can sell $600 Billion dollars in US Savings Bonds and not claim that it is
a Inflationary issue…..well, building a little $100 Billion Dollar deal…can’t be that bad..can
it?
Sell and lease back the freeways, assess a per miles fee on autos (trucks busses etc) to recover the lease back fees plus cost and a small profit the cover future pension obligations.
Then use the selling proceeds to build the new railway corridors. (HSR and freight, local, amtrac, etc)