UCI Chancellor Michael Drake is continuing his effort to add a law school to his campus – but the real question is – do we need another law school in Orange County? According to an article in today’s OC Register, “Orange County already has three American Bar Association-approved law schools, at Chapman University, Whittier Law School in Costa Mesa and Western State University College of Law in Fullerton.”
An analyst from the California Postsecondary Education Commission (CPEC), Stacy Wilson, found that “”They are demonstrating a significant need and shortage of supply, but we have some serious questions about how they updated (the statistics).”
The real need in the OC is for a four year occupational safety program. We currently lack even a two year program! As a member of the OC Chapter of the ASSE (American Society of Safety Engineers) I have already discussed this with John Hanna, a trustee at the Rancho Santiago Community College District. They have a terrific program for firefighters – and could easily add a safety curriculum.
According to the State of California Employment Department, here is the outlook for a number of safety positions in California – these figures represent only a sliver of the entire occupational safety market:
Occupational Health and Safety Specialists:
- Current positions (as of 2004): 3,700
- Projected employment, through 2014: 4,200
- Average annual openings: 130
- Hourly mean salary: $30.19
Occupational Health and Safety Technicians:
- Hourly mean salary: $25.41
- Other data not available
Health and SafetyEngineerss, excluding mining safety:
- Current positions (as of 2004): 3,200
- Projected employment, through 2014: 3,800
- Average annual openings: 140
- Hourly mean salary: $35.50
Emergency Management Specialists
- Hourly mean salary: $33.75
- Other data not available
My own personal experience is that a safety professional with a four year degree, some experience, and other certifications, can easily earn over $100,000 a year – in fact I know of several such openings at this time. Virtually every industry needs safety professionals – LAUSD is currently looking to hire at least four to six just to supervise their new school construction projects, at salaries between $90K and $100K.
Also, the projections noted above are far too low. Go to any job search engine and search for positions that include “safety.” There are always dozens of jobs open – and trained, experienced applicants are rare.
Insurance companies also hire safety professionals, and pay them very well. Other sectors with high demand for safety professionals include: manufacturing, construction, agriculture, and the government. That’s right – every municipal agency needs safety engineers – and many are getting older and will need to be replaced in a few years. The need is ready to go critical, in my opinion, as baby boomers retire.
To be fair, the current projections for lawyers, in the Orange County area, are 145 per year, through 2014. The hourly mean salary is $65.72, however I can tell you from personal experience, having worked at two law firms as a marketing director, that young attorneys can expect to make perhaps $30,000 to $40,000 per year for the first six years after they finish law school. It takes awhile for them to learn enough to be able to make more money.
The truth is, safety professionals can make similar salaries and can also expect to earn a lot more after they have five years of experience. There is in fact a huge demand for bilingual safety professionals, so youngsters growing up in Santa Ana could easily craft a great career by starting at Santa Ana College, and transferring to UCI, or CSUF, to finish a four year program. But of course right now there are no such programs in our county.
The only programs I am aware of are a four year environmental and safety program at Cal State Northridge, and a two year program at Rio Hondo Community College, in Whittier. That’s it. There are also one year safety certificate programs at UCI’s extension campus, and at Cal State Rancho Dominguez.
My personal sentiment is that UCI’s Chancellor wants a law school primarily because it would be a huge recipient of donations, from parents of students, and later from alumni. I think it is more important, and vital to our area, to promote a four year safety program. What do our reader’s think? Do we really need more lawyers – or do we need to focus on worker and public safety? In this post-911 era, the answer should be readily apparent.
Just two quick comments:
1) In this post-9/11 era, what we need, just as much as safetly professionals, are individuals who are trained to protect our human rights.
2) I am a young attorney and I don’t know a single young attorney in the private sector who makes $30K to $40K. Large law firms pay you at least triple that amount your first year out of law school, and smaller firms usually pay double.
The law profession, like the real estate profession is posed for a collapse.
Look at how many of them can
Poster 1,
My point is that there are already a plethora of options for those who want to be lawyers – but ther are NO programs for those who want to protect our workers – while also protecting employers from litigation that ensues from workplace accidents. This is also a great career option for Latinos, given the need for bilingual professionals.
Also, the firms I worked at handled criminal defense and intellectual property, respectively. Yes, top law grads get more money – but most grads are not superstars. The lower and mid-level grads work hard for years to make good money.
The answer is no. And your suggestion is a good one, although good luck trying to get it on UCI’s radar screen.
The UCI Law School has always been a sticking point in the side of UCI.
I want to see them have a law school, but over the years the alumni have fought the idea of a law school.
UCI is just trying to be a UCLA powerhouse in Orange County. With the only law school options being private here in the OC, a public law school with the backing of the UC is a good idea.
Art,
I agree that there are a plethora of expensive, private, third tier law school in OC. I also agree that, unfortunately, many of the grads from the law schools here in Orange County don’t make big money their first few years out, but that is even more of a reason why a school with the reputation of the UC system should open a law school in OC. The average graduate from a UC law school makes six figures their first year as an associate. We should want that type of opportunity for our youth, especially our youth in Santa Ana, many of whom are denied more opportunities than they are presented with.
I agree with poster no. 6. There isn’t even a top tier law school in Southern California.
We’d do well to have a public law school that can compete for talent against UCLA, USC and Loyola.
A UCI Law School would be great… and they should locate it in the Santa Ana Civic Center right across the street from the new 4th District Court of Appeal!