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November 20, 2014Posted in: "The OC", Fresh Juice
The speech is over. The response is not. Have at it.
You know what to do. What was your reaction?
About Greg Diamond
Somewhat verbose attorney, semi-disabled and semi-retired, residing in northwest Brea. Occasionally ran for office against jerks who otherwise would have gonr unopposed. Got 45% of the vote against Bob Huff for State Senate in 2012; Josh Newman then won the seat in 2016. In 2014 became the first attorney to challenge OCDA Tony Rackauckas since 2002; Todd Spitzer then won that seat in 2018. Every time he's run against some rotten incumbent, the *next* person to challenge them wins! He's OK with that.
Corrupt party hacks hate him. He's OK with that too.
He does advise some local campaigns informally and (so far) without compensation. (If that last bit changes, he will declare the interest.)
His daughter is a professional campaign treasurer. He doesn't usually know whom she and her firm represent. Whether they do so never influences his endorsements or coverage. (He does have his own strong opinions.) But when he does check campaign finance forms, he is often happily surprised to learn that good candidates he respects often DO hire her firm. (Maybe bad ones are scared off by his relationship with her, but they needn't be.)
A friend of mine posts on Facebook:
Another post from Facebook, on a Biblical theme:
“Obama paraphrased Leviticus 19:34: ‘treat the stranger among you as one of your own, for you yourself were a stranger in the land.'”
Oh, Good Lord. Democrats spouting the Good Book to the Bible beaters.
I can’t think of a worse way to address policy issues.
Speaking to constituents in their own language is the worst way to address policy issues you can think of?
It’s not Obama’s doing that many people will be more persuaded by Bible verses than by careful economic studies. But that’s the constituency he has. How exactly do you think he should try to reach them — or should he not at all?
I know! Let’s make it all about the vets. Somehow we can do it!
If you step back a moment and regard how you segued from a discussion of broad moral bases if immigration strategy to a petty quibble about the pretty much plain vanilla campaign tactics used sell Measure J to voters, I suspect that even you will be a little surprised.
It is disingenuous at the least – he lies like a fuckin’ rug and we all know it – more than 20 times he said that he couldn’t do what he is doing now. You know when he is lying …
He has never said that he couldn’t take this action. Go find me a citation, one that you’ve checked out yourself rather than just taken and parroted from some loony-bin site. He said that he didn’t want to, that he prefers it to be done by Congress — and he says that he still does.
“f you step back a moment and regard how you segued from a discussion of broad moral bases if immigration strategy to a petty quibble about the pretty much plain vanilla campaign tactics used sell Measure J to voters, I suspect that even you will be a little surprised.”
It’s about saying things you don’t believe yourself to get what you want. Plain vanilla? Right. The exploitation of pro-vet sympathy to sell a half-billion dollar bond? Quoting the Old Testament? That’s gotta be a first for Obama.
What’s next, citing Joshua and Judges to defend open borders? We are the land of milk and honey, after all.
I’d like to think that the irony of your flipping out over what Measure J’s advocates said in support of their proposal at the same time that yet another Congressional panel has put the lie to the widely touted (and likely effective) Benghazi accusations that your party successfully used to tarnish Obama in this just completed elections (by triggering the public’s “if there’s smoke, there’s fire” heuristic) is not entirely lost on you.
Yes, “plain vanilla.” That some portion of the bond funds are to be used specifically for veterans programs is not, so far as I can tell, a lie; it’s not the same as the brunt of the money going towards repairs that help veterans and non-veterans alike. Their emphasizing the sexy thing that the Bond funds over the quotidian is “plain vanilla” campaign strategy — as you surely know. So why so sneerious?
As for Obama quoting the Tanakh (Hebrew Bible) in his speech, I very much doubt that that’s a first for him. I just did a Google search and found these New Testament quotes in this article: http://www.christianpost.com/news/obama-quotes-bible-verses-on-heaven-2-corinthians-4-16-18-and-matthew-19-14-at-sandy-hook-prayer-vigil-86757/. It seems likely that he has reached back a little further as well, don’t you think?
I think that you should also be offended by the ease with which some political actors make and then eventually abandon vicious attacks on their opponents, allowing them to prosper based on the festering residue the initial thrust leaves behind.
And I think that this article should settle the matter:
http://articles.latimes.com/2010/aug/14/local/la-me-beliefs-obama-rhetoric-20100814
Obama’s memoirs show that he was exposed, as the child of an anthropologist mother, to many religious traditions, but found his faith as an adult while exploring the African American side of his identity at the Trinity United Church of Christ on the south side of Chicago.
Siker found that the president quotes the Old Testament most often in his public addresses, in particular the Exodus story of liberation from slavery, an oft-mentioned biblical theme in the African American community.
“This blending of stories allows for powerful improvisations and riffs on the biblical narrative as it is retold and reappropriated in the 20th and 21st centuries,” Siker said. “Barack Obama has made effective use of this merged story in his political rhetoric.”
But the two most prevalent motifs that Obama draws from the Bible are that “we are our brother’s keeper” ( Genesis 4:9) and the notion of the “Joshua generation.”
“This vision of being my brother’s keeper has important political and social consequences when it comes to such issues as healthcare, consumer protection or education reform,” Siker said at the meeting.
In the run-up to the 2008 presidential campaign, Obama dubbed the younger generation of Americans the Joshua generation that must finish the work of what he called the “Moses generation,” older Americans who made sacrifices to bring the nation this far. (Joshua, according to the biblical story, became leader of the Israelites after God barred Moses from entering the promised land.)
“The previous generation, the Moses generation, pointed the way,” Obama said in a March 2007 speech in Selma, Alabama. “So the question, I guess, that I have today is what’s called of us in this Joshua generation? What do we do in order to fulfill that legacy; to fulfill the obligations and the debt that we owe to those who allowed us to be here today?”
In June of 2008, Obama’s campaign launched the “Joshua Generation Project,” calling on young Christian voters to live out this biblical narrative.
I guess it’s time to move onto the next assertion.
Whoa, Greg! Before we move on check this video out of Obama mocking and misinterpreting the bible back in 2006. Quoting bible verses he doesn’t understand thus he mocks and defames scripture. Now he claims to be guided by it. What a farce! Spare America the hypocritical piety. I call him “the great imposter”. Goebbels would have been proud of Obama’s propoganda. Obama could have been his Chief of Staff.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hi-V_ilJu0w
More silence.
Well, you’re not making a lot of sense, although you are making a lot of noise. I don’t see much here that I need to take seriously enough to refute. Saying “six million criminals” is like screaming out “don’t take anything I have to say seriously.” Besides, others who feel like arguing with you are doing the job quite well.
amen brother zenger, amen!
let them all in,,,,
i need a new gardener
Now that Beelzebub, the rabid anti-immigrant former VOC commenter is gone, I expect LtPar/Pat Rodgers to take his place on this issue in the local blog-sphere. Rodgers sounds Beelzebub, using same phrases (falling off the turnip truck/ selling a bridge in Brooklyn).
They/He must agree with GOP Senator Tom Coburn’s views but I hope they don’t take the Senator too seriously on his statements that “the country is going to go nuts…you could see instances of anarchy….you could see violence.”
Pure political theatre, nothing more.
Bad policy Good politics.
Now I’m really tangled up in blue.
If you’ve been here, dodged “La Migra” all these years, and haven’t caused trouble, I say you’ve already earned “American.” Might as well make it legit. Wasn’t your fault you were born somewhere else.
Excecutive Order is the wrong way to handles this, but the Republicans in Congress have made clear they aren’t going to play ball — 5 million American residents be damned — so I’m sort of okay with this.
It’s definitely a plus for our society.
The real solution is to fix our legal immigration so that, for most, the first step to becoming an American isn’t paying a criminal to help you break the law.
But that would require Congress, and after three years, how much longer can Obama wait?
No real American smart enough to figure this scam out would ever approve of it. Have you seen one black leader condemn Obama’s actions for legalizing 6 million criminals who stole millions of jobs from poor black citizens. Even Al Sharpton was applauding Obama on MSNBC. Yes, the illegals compete directly for the jobs that many of our black underclass need to pull themselves our of poverty and live lives of dignity. But Obama could care less about them. In the last 6 years the average black person’s net worth has fallen by more than 15%. How’s that for ‘hope and change’?
Additionally, Mexico and Central America keeps their intelligensia and skilled workers at home and encourage their garbage to violate our border for the stupid Americans to support and care for. And yep, the stupid Americans open up their wallets!!! No other nation on the planet allows such nonsense. If it benefited nations to allow indigent foreigners to breach their borders and steal jobs from their citizens – all nations would be doing it. The fact that we’re the only country that participates in such insanity should open up the eyes of any casual observer UNLESS you have your own special agenda OR are just too stupid to connect the dots.
Rewarding criminals and punishing good people was NEVER a formula for success to any sovereign nation. It’s a formula for disaster. Because it sends a message (subconsciously or overtly) to the law-abiding population that breaking the law is acceptable, encouraged and may result in rewards. This is especially true when the lawmakers who are sworn under oath to honor, protect, uphold and enforce the laws of the land are the promoters of such nonsense. If they disrespect our laws – why should common ordinary unsworn citizens have any respect for the laws? And the unintended consequences will soon be apparent. Keep your eyes on Ferguson and St. Louis, Mo!
About 75% of Americans, according to the Gallup polls, were vehemently opposed to Obama’s amnesty (legalization) action. Over half the democrats. In fact, on November 4 the Oregonians repealed a driver’s licenses for illegals law passed by their state legislature!!! And Oregon largely consists of liberal democrats. Here’s the kicker: the Oregonians who opposed the DL’s for illegals law were outspent 11 to 1. Yet they successfully repealed the law by a margin of about 35% of the voters!!! What does that tell you? And what does that indicate about the general sentiment of the entire nation if the liberal democrats feel it’s wrong to reward criminals??? Ponder that!!!
And this was a bi-partisan effort on the Hill. The Republican electeds may feign anger for good theater but they were all in on it from the very start. And this will be evidenced by their refusal to do anything about it. The House controls the nation’s purse strings. The Republicans could refuse to fund Obama’s amnesty. But they will roll over and do nothing. Watch and learn, my friends. The entire nation has been hoodwinked once again. The ignorance and the apathy and the complete lack of insight is simply overwhelming. This was all planned and intentional as a means to reward the ruling class – the same bankers and corporate heads that you Occupy Wall Street protesters so bitterly despised. You folks have been fooled once again. This time you have no excuse other than feigned ignorance or the fact that you too have sold out and joined the other side. Touche!!!
I am left with the feeling after his speech that this changes nothing because it seems to me that few people will come forward to seek some kind of permit to stay here that is good for ony 5 years. If I am in fear of the authorities, whiy would I self-identify for this 5 year reprieve? So, I think this is a lot of noise about very little.
I disagree that our immigration system is “broken”.
I question why people should be allowed to cut the line in front of others who follow the legal path to America.
Diamond wanted a citation on Obama’s immigration fuckin’ lies – here ya go buddy – from PolitiFact:
“When asked to explain why he suddenly feels he can use executive action to address immigration issues, Obama said, “My position hasn’t changed.”
Obama has been asked about his ability to use his office to change immigration rules in the U.S. in many ways throughout the years. Sometimes, he has been asked broadly, but other times, he was asked about very specific measures, such as not splitting up families or freezing deportations for parents of DREAMers.
In answering those questions, Obama’s position has clearly changed. Whereas he used to say his ability to take action ended at deferring action on DREAMers, he now is saying there are at least some things he can do and intends to do. Even absent the specifics of his plan, it’s very clear his tune is much different now.
We rate the claim False.”
The biggest change is that Obama has just agreed to add to our already massive impoverished population w/50M on food stamps. (You have to be destitute to receive foodstamps). California is already the most impoverished state in the union, according to the Census Bureau. Now these criminal foreigners will get their legalization and soon thereafter another swarm of foreign criminals will violate our immigration laws and crash our borders and steal THEIR jobs – forcing them onto the public assistance rolls that all of us are forced to finance. Obama’s actions were all about rewarding the ruling class, so that they can pack their hotels and manufacturing warehouses and construction sites with slave labor. Stealing jobs from American citizens is no different than breaking into their homes and stealing their jewelry or big screens. Destruction of the middle class. Rich and poor! When a nation dismisses the laws to appease certain groups of people (cops, politicians, illegals, Wall Street bankers, etc….) it’s only a matter of time before the empire falls. When ‘equality under the law’ becomes a farce we are no better than a 3rd world banana republic. Only traitors and those who wish to see America brought to it’s knees would support Obama’s actions. No other nation on earth would legalize millions of illiterate indigents who broke into their country and stole jobs from their citizens. In fact, America has become the laughing stock of the rest of the nation. Even the 3rd world banana republics laugh at us for being so stupid as to tolerate the actions of a totalitarian dictator like Obama!
Are you for real Mr Spellbound?
I can’t even begin to start….anyway it IS good to have a scapegoat for the ills of our society. And how much poorer we are having YOU in it.
Now go and put your sheet on — the Klan has Saturday Meet’nGreet!
That’s all you got, Paula? Personal insults without substance? Your comment is a reflection of your own cowardice. You said much more about yourself than you did me! But you’re so ignorant you probably don’t even realize it.
I’ve connected the dots and reached different conclusions than yours. See link below. You may not realize but your argument is full of insults (criminals, illegals, traitors), which is not conducive to take your arguments seriously.
http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2014/06/undocumented-the-paranoia-of-monsieur-b/
Those who break into our nation and steal our jobs are criminals. Those who break into our nation and steal our jobs are illegals. Those Americans who aid and abet such criminals and illegals are traitors.
It’s not my problem that you can’t handle the truth.
Poor Mr Spellbound, somebody stole his job picking strawberries. Or mowing lawns. Or babysitting his neighbors’ brats. Give me a break. These folks are here because we need them.
It takes a helluva lot of nerve for ANY American citizen to talk about “breaking in” and taking things…like a nation.
Try getting getting a little perspective, Spellbound.
Vern – you perpetuate another myth. That the only jobs these foreign criminals take are picking fruit or caretaking. Criminal foreigners have taken over the construction, manufacturing, hospitality and landscaping industries in California. Those are all jobs that Americans have traditionally worked. So if you have to exaggerate to prove your point it only shows your desperation. In fact, a recent study indicated that in the last 10 years that nearly all the job growth went to legal and illegal migrants even though native born Americans accounted for the overwhelming majority of the actual population growth. The more I prove that you folks are wrong, the more disingenuous you appear. And if you are disingenuous on this subject matter – on how many other topics do you misinform the pubic?
Anon, I fully agree with you that America invades and robs other nations. The common US citizen does not support it. Our fraudulent leaders are the instigators. Now that liar Obama has even escalated America’s combat role in Afghanistan after he told us all our troops would get withdrawn by 2014. A bald-faced liar MANY times over! But that does not justify our government allowing a full-blown invasion of America by indigent illiterates which hurts our taxpayers and impoverishes our underclass who stuggle to find jobs.
The “common US citizen” does not support the invasion of this land by Europeans?
You’re delusional.
The US had not even been formed when the europeans arrived. How could it’s citizens have supported them?
You’re not delusional. Just ignorant.
Most US citizens are perfectly fine with the fact that our forefathers invaded and stole this land. So don’t try and feed us this BS about Americans not supporting invasion. Conceptually, we’re perfectly comfortable with it when it suits our purposes.
While you’re at it, go ahead and convince us that the majority of Americans didn’t support the invasion of Afghanistan.
And when it comes to Iraq, I’d point you to this Gallup poll, conducted in March 2003, showing solid support for invading.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/7990/Public-Support-Iraq-Invasion-Inches-Upward.aspx
When it comes right down to it, we’re a pretty bloodthirsty lot.
“While you’re at it, go ahead and convince us that the majority of Americans didn’t support the invasion of Afghanistan.”
Americans supported going after the terrorists who plotted the destruction of the world trade centers and the murder of 3000 innocent civilians. Americans did not support staying there 13 years. That was the work of our fraudulent leaders. Not us.
“When it comes right down to it, we’re a pretty bloodthirsty lot.”
Yes, I agree. The world is full of bloodthirsty tyrants. Did you read about the 43 students in Mexico who were murdered by government agents? Do you think Mexico has clean hands? The bottom line is that America is a sovereign nation and we have black letter immigration laws that our sworn leaders of our nation are obligated to uphold, honor and protect. That is the agreement the had with us. They have reneged on their part of the contract with the American people. That is not our fault. That is their fault. And blaming the American people for that would be an act of pur ignorance.
And yet, we didn’t HAVE to invade Afghanistan, did we? We could have chosen not to.
And the majority of Americans supported the invasion of Iraq.
You’re notions about our support for invasions are wrong.
“And yet, we didn’t HAVE to invade Afghanistan, did we? We could have chosen not to.”
When terrorists from foreign nations destroy the financial center of another nation and murder 3,000 of it’s civilians it requires a swift and immediate aggressive response. To choose not to would be an act of cowardice.
“And the majority of Americans supported the invasion of Iraq.”
I didn’t. That’s for sure. Whether Americans used poor judgment with Iraq has nothing to do with whether we should allow a nation of illiterate indigents to violate our sovereign borders and cause immense damage to our own nation. Mexico is one of the most bloodthirsty nations on earth. The drug cartels are allowed to run their society. Their corrupted leaders are in bed with the drug lords. And now they want to infect America with thier problems. I say “no”. I am a real American who loves his country.
“You’re notions about our support for invasions are wrong.”
I’ve already specifically pointed out all your misinformation and errors which are numerous in quantity.
BAAA!
BAAA!
Too cowardly to fight!
WAAA!
You are too intelligent! And too correct in your assessments about politics and economics! I’m not worthy! Not even worthy to kiss the hem of your robe!
Besides, the Klan is trying to attract more diversity these days. Ya never know who might be under that sheet next to you at the cross burnings!
now go play–gotta work yo XOXO!
There you go again, Paula. You are showing us your character. You have no substance. You are nothing more than an ignorant provacateur. Every message board has some. This one is no different.
“Yes, “plain vanilla.” That some portion of the bond funds are to be used specifically for veterans programs is not, so far as I can tell, a lie; it’s not the same as the brunt of the money going towards repairs that help veterans and non-veterans alike. Their emphasizing the sexy thing that the Bond funds over the quotidian is “plain vanilla” campaign strategy — as you surely know. So why so sneerious?”
Actually it is as good as a lie and duplicitous. If that’s “plain vanilla” – misleading voters then surely we have hit rock bottom. Why bother with the truth anymore?
Okay I was wrong. Obama has quoted scripture several time in six years. He’s a regular Elmer Gantry. American huckster politics would be no where without the Good Book.
So any quoting of the Good Book is hucksterism? I leave open the possibility that some people, politicians included, do quote it accurately, perspicaciously, and in good faith.
I’ll port over the Measure J bullet points from the other item:
Key Measure J investment priorities include:
Upgrades to antiquated science labs, lecture halls, technology and instructional equipment to better prepare students for growing fields of study and high-skill careers.
Enhancements of classroom space and training centers for future nurses, firefighters and other first responders, as well as technically-trained workers.
Expansion of veterans’ facilities and services as well as job-placement centers to train and re-train veterans as they transition into the civilian workforce.
I just have a hard time believing that this emphasis is what sends you over the top. On the Richter scale of 21st-century American politics, NOCCCD emphasizing the benefits of these repairs and expansions to veterans registers at about the level of an ant fart.
By the way — if reports that LA is done with its counting are true, you’ll see from the updated post on that topic that Measure J has passed by a margin of about 26 votes out of 154,096.
The lie got it passed, and that’s a fact.
BTW, you have never seen me “over the top.”
David Zenger, most of Obama’s foreign and domestic policies have been predicated upon lies. Obamacare, immigration, Fast ‘n Furious, IRSgate, Benghazi, Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, Solyndra, etc….based upon a mutlitude of lies that even he couldn’t hide. Those who support him support a tyrant con-artist who has sucked out whatever integrity was left in our Federal government. I hated Bush. I hate Obama even more. The damage he has caused to the fabric of our nation is irreversible.
Obama’s tenure has just been W’s third and fourth terms. On the bright side Hillary would have somehow managed to be even worse. So you have that to look forward to.
However, Obama is hardly worth hating.
you didn’t hate Bush, you voted for him twice
Untrue. I never voted for Bush 43. Not once. So you are misinformed.
Did you read that 30,000 of Lois Lerner’s emails that Obama’s IRS appointees perjured themselves over during testiony before Congress, saying that Lerner’s computer crashed, therefore all those emails disappeared into cyberspace and were irretrievable, were suddenly found by Federal investigators AFTER the elections were over??? Gee, a miracle! Obama’s administration has to be the most dishonest bunch of scoundrel bureacrats in the history of the nation. So now Lerner gets dragged before Congress again. She’s either going to have to: (1) Give up the conspiracy and implicate all those Obamaites involved in the IRS targeting TP conservatives, or (2) She’s headed to the big house for a very long time and can take her lying IRS buddies with her.
The black people are ready to take to the streets over the Michael Brown shooting in Ferguson, Mo but are silent as butterflys over a half-black President legalizing 6 million foreign criminals and allowing those criminals to keep the jobs that they stole from the black community who live in poverty. Looks to me that the President’s policy is to keep black people poor. How else could you interpret his most recent action? And where are the black congressional leaders? Why aren’t they condemning this action that hurts their own black people? What a disillusioned and mind-numbed society in which we live!
You folks who were active in Occupy Wall Street (as I was) should be particularly ashamed of yourselves. Obama’s executive amnesty order was executed for BIG BUSINESS and the Wall Street pigs. It condones cheap labor. And it has a horrendous effect on our underclass communities, to include our black citizens, who the liberals claim to support. The illegal migrants who broke into our nation and stole jobs from our black citizens are now allowed to keep those jobs, thereby keeping our black citizens poor. Liberals who promote this concept are dyed in the wool hypocrites and should be thoroughly ashamed. Yet they continue to spin this topic to distort the matter in attempt to convince us that war is peace, freedom is slavery and
ignorance is strength. Truly it is shameful!
I love how “TEA” drinkers suddenly become “concerned” about African Americans when they bring up immigration. Of course, they never mention how their preferred economic policies have allowed for all this divestment from inner city communities. No, just pit minority communities against each other by claiming one is “stealing jobs” from the other.
Liberals (LBJ followers) have always been the ones so concerned about the plight of the black communities. So don’t act so pious. Now all the liberal democrats (to include the black liberal congress members, Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, etc…) stab the black communities square in the back by advocating legalization of 6 million criminals who illegally forced their way into our nation and stole jobs for impoverished blacks who the liberals want to keep poor. The average black family has lost more than 15% of their net worth in the last 6 years under Obama. Do you hear any of the democrats squawking about that? No. Do you see any of the liberal bloggers writing about that? No. All hypocrites. Instead of concurring with the TRUTH that Obama and the liberals are harming our black people by promoting amnesty for illegals they blame it all on the Tea Party just like OC-Ex Pat has attempted to do above. No truth. No accountability. Just more Blan Blah Blah Blah Blah!!!
The recession began in 2007. Who was President then?
Growth resumed in 2010. Who was President then?
And last I checked, working poor immigrants are not the ones denying business loans, foreclosing homes, and finding other ways to prey upon inner city communities.
“Growth resumed in 2010. Who was President then?”
More profound ignorance I see. The only thing that kept this bubble economy afloat for the past 6 years has been trillions of dollars of corporate bailouts, quantitative easing (money printing), perpetual zero-interest rates and massive accumulations of debt. We are still running half-trillion dollar deficits. If the economy was in good shape and growing they would allow the interest rates to rise. On the contrary they have artificially supressed them because they know once they normalize that they don’t have the funds to pay the interest on our federal debt without the nation collapsing. And those entrenched in ignorance support them!!! They have no clue about what these fraudulent leaders are doing to our nation or the financial apocalypse that awaits us in the future.
” And last I checked, working poor immigrants are not the ones denying business loans, foreclosing homes, and finding other ways to prey upon inner city communities.”
The illegal illiterate indigent foreigners have done more than their fair share to destroy America. They stole millions of jobs from our underclass citizens. They’ve cost us trillions in free medical care and education. In California illegal foreigners occupy 30% of our prison beds at a cost of $50,000 per head per year. And their crimes that landed them in state prison took a huge toll on our US citizens. But you choose to ignore those facts, don’t you, anon???
This was long overdue. And at last, it finally happened. These American families should not have to live in constant fear because certain Members of Congress prefer to use them as political footballs rather than provide any real solutions to this problem.
Those families include criminals who broke the law and stole jobs from US citizens. There are millions of good, honest, prospective foreign immigrants overseas who play by the rules. They sent in their application with their fee. They’ve taken their tests. They’re medically screened. They actually have skills. They don’t want to hide in the shadows. They want to openly become part of the America system and contribute to our country and grasp the American dream (which really no longer exists). Yet those honest, law-abiding foreigners are placed on hold for 10 years or longer. Some are NEVER invited to America. Whereas, if they only traveled to Mexico and snuck across the border 5 years ago today they would get rewarded for it. What kind of message does that sent to all Americans and foreigners. It says that if you break the law it’s acceptable and you may even get rewarded for it. That is one of the most repulsive messages that a government could send throughout the world because it is the antithesis of civilization itself. Now watch new illiterate indigent illegal foreigners swarm into America thinking that they too will get their just rewards for breaking the law. California certainly won’t deport them with the “TRUST ACT” that Jerry Brown signed into law. This means that California’s already record poverty rates go ballistic. More and more foreign parasites will come to California and YOU will be forced to finance their free medical care, free education, and in many cases welfare. Why? BECAUSE YOU PROMOTED IT!!! Watch out what you wished for!!!!
It sends the message that something needs to be done to fix our screwed up immigration system. Where are all these people suppsoed to go? ‘Baggers always reply, “BACK OF THE LINE!!!” But for DREAMers who came here when they were children, there is no line. There is no starting point. There isn’t even a process.
That’s the reality of the immigration system. It’s incredibly long and unbearably backlogged. Oh, and it’s awfully expensive. These days, one must either be wealthy, snatched by the right employer, or hooked in with very supportive family to complete the arduous path to citizenship.
This is the reality that anti-immigrant fire-breathers refuse to acknowledge.
SNL nails it –
https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=dEYlwE9M668
That was pure comedy, skallywag. They say that good comedy must contain truth. And that SLN skit contained a ton of truth. These electeds are nothing but criminals themselves who have no respect for the American process. Whatever it is….legalizing 6 million illegal foreigners, executing airstrikes on sovereign nations without any international legal basis, lying to get their health care laws approved, lying about the emails in IRSgate with Lois Lerner, indefinitely extending the Patriot Act which denies due process to US citizens, etc…they don’t give a damn about legalities when the law stands in the way of their nefarious goals. In that case, they simply ignore the laws. The laws are only there for the US citizen peasants to obey. If you happen to be an illegal foreigner or a Wall Street banker or a high ranking politician – you are immune to the laws. This nation is toast. They’ve taken a BEAUTIFUL concept and destroyed it.
*During World War II……pregnant women would jump from boats three miles out to sea just to get to the shores of the United States, to have their babies. People forget about all the WOPs (With Out Papers) of the Vito Corelones during the years before World War I. People forget about all the Swedes, Irish, Germans, Puerto Ricans to NY, Cubans during the 70’s ….all came to this country without waiting in any lines, dutifully paying thousands of dollars for the ability to invest their millions in the United States economy. Australia put up a variety of these dollar requirements as far back as the the 60’s. They didn’t want Americans polluting their Outback Steak Houses without a fat wallet. The President slammed the Republican Stink Tanks right in the shorts with a master stroke. It ensures that Hilliary will be elected in 2016. It ensures that all those Republican Special Investigative Committees go running for the exits and the Cloak Room. It ensures a legacy for a tremendous leader in spite of being black.. America….love it or leave it……. Time to get used to that One World Government you have heard so much about. Walmart asked for cheap labor and we got it. Now live with it folks…….it will be around for a long, long time.
I find it interesting how the ‘Ships bag so much on Reeps – but not so much on Dems.
Riper targets.
Ron and Ana, you two need to take a trip to NYC in a bad way and take a tour of Ellis Island. America has always promoted an ORDERLY immigration process. Everyone who came through Ellis Island was not accepted. We were actually selective over who we allowed into our country. Some were actually put back on the boat and sent back to where they came from. There was a reason for that. It’s the same reason all civilized nations screen their applicant residents. Because doing otherwise harms the interests of a sovereign nation. This is all common sense. If disorderly immigration is good for a nation – why not send cargo ships to all 4 corners of the earth and pack them full of illiterate indigents and bring them back to American, Ana and Ron? Would you be in favor of that??? So why would you be in favor of legalizing 6 million illiterate indigents who broke into your country and stole millions of jobs from our own impoverished US citizens who remain poor??? Hmmm??? Let’s have a sensible debate. Okay???
You mean a process that regularly turned away immigrants who were “not from the right countries”?
Looks like you need to take a trip to NYC and tour Ellis Island too. People were screened for their medical and mental fitness. Those who didn’t make the cut were sent back to where they came from. Baseball and football teams choose the best players to add to their rosters. Civilized nations or do the same thing. Uncivilized nations (or nations prone to self-destruction) accept anyone who shows up at their doorstep. This is pure common sense and has nothing to do with political affiliation or ideology. The ignorance on this board is simply astounding.
Not only did Walmart ask for cheap labor…so did very, very powerful American industries, like agriculture, meat processing and hospitality services.
There’s your free market, Mr. Spellbound, hard at work!
No civilized sane nation has a “free” employment market that invites illegal, indigent, illiterate foreigners to invade their sovereign land and steal jobs from their own citizens. You cannot even name one. Because such a nation does not exist except for the insane United States of America. The rest of the world laughs at us. I have spoken to legal citizens from 3rd world nations who live in America. They all tell me that in their countries of origin all the people laugh hysterically at America’s immigration policy. Even the banana republics realize it’s insane. Yet some incredibly stupid Americans support it!!! The ones who are easily brainwashed and manipulated by the progressives. Stupid is as stupid does!
Diamond wanted a citation on Obama’s immigration fuckin’ lies – here ya go buddy – from PolitiFact:
“When asked to explain why he suddenly feels he can use executive action to address immigration issues, Obama said, “My position hasn’t changed.”
Obama has been asked about his ability to use his office to change immigration rules in the U.S. in many ways throughout the years. Sometimes, he has been asked broadly, but other times, he was asked about very specific measures, such as not splitting up families or freezing deportations for parents of DREAMers.
In answering those questions, Obama’s position has clearly changed. Whereas he used to say his ability to take action ended at deferring action on DREAMers, he now is saying there are at least some things he can do and intends to do. Even absent the specifics of his plan, it’s very clear his tune is much different now.
We rate the claim False.”
Provide one quote — hopefully PolitiFact did include one — where Obama actually “used to say his ability to take action ended at deferring action on DREAMers.” My guess is that the statement was neither that blunt nor that definitive. Could be wrong, though — in which case I guess that his advisors came to a new conclusion. Shocking.
Splitting hairs again I see Diamond – keep slicing – I am sure you can use your convoluted “logic” to put some meat on the bones of Obama’s excuses for his lies.
Skally – Greg is a sworn employment attorney. Surely he supports our US and State labor laws. He has to be on our side. No way could he support illegal indigent illiterate foreigners coming to America and swiping our jobs. By profession, he is obligated to abhor it. Afterall, he is sworn under oath!
Assuming by illiterate you mean “unable to read or write,” what percentage of folks coming across our southern border can’t read or write Spanish?
Mexico’s Secretary of Education Emilio Chuayffet reported that almost 50 million Mexicans are illiterate. Mexico’s population is 112 million. Who do you think are crashing our borders? The literate Mexicans or the illiterate Mexicans? Apply common sense. A literate American citizen should know the answer. Mexico’s intelligensia certainly aren’t sneaking across the border and stealing jobs from our US underclass!
This information is readily available on internet. Literate US citizens should be able to find it. If you have trouble let me know. I’ll drop a proof source on ya.
Wrong.
Mexico’s literacy rate is approximately 93.4%
http://www.statista.com/statistics/275443/literacy-rate-in-mexico
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_literacy_rate
http://www.indexmundi.com/mexico/literacy.html
http://www.unicef.org/infobycountry/mexico_statistics.html
Are you guys moderating comments now. I have a comment here in response to Spellbound’s 7:01pm comment that shows as being in moderation.
Sorry that one had a few links so one of us had to approve it.
Comments are automatically sent to moderation if they show certain warning signs. One of them is having more than a certain number of links in the comment (maybe as a proportion of text), as that is favored by spammers. I think that that is the one that snagged you.
anon, is that a dodge? My comments post just fine. If it is I recommend we strike an agreement. If you stump me I’ll promise that I will publicly concede. Let’s make it reciprocal, okay? I find that’s the most rewarding form of discourse. No one gets mad. No one throws barbs. We simply learn from one another. And in the end, that’s why we’re all here, right? To learn? It’s extremely difficult to find such conversations in 2014. But I won’t give up. I’m confident there’s at least one mature adult in the crowd.
No dodge Spelly – SOP fir comments with links to be approved
“While Guerrero, Oaxaca and Chiapas states deal with striking school teachers whose complaints are perennial, the Secretary of Education has reported that almost 50 million Mexicans are illiterate, or lack the basics of even a primary school education.”
“Mexico has 15.5 million illiterate citizens, according to SEP, and more than 32 million who have not completed primary school. The latter number represents about 40% of persons over 15 years of age. Mexico has a population of 112 million, with a median age of 26.”
http://www.mexicogulfreporter.com/2013/04/illiteracy-rudimentary-education-hold.html
Going back to the discussion, which group do you think crashes the US border and steals jobs from US citizens? The educated Mexicans or the illiterate, uneducated Mexicans?
Please, let’s have a sensible debate here? Agree?
Just because a person has not completed primary school does not mean they are illiterate.
It’s telling that you want to include that population in your numbers. It says a lot about you.
The literacy rate in Mexico is about 93.5% That is a fact.
Your position on the number of illiterate Mexicans crossing our southern border is nothing more than speculation. Pure speculation. You’re going to call it common sense? OK, my common sense tells me that it would be far LESS realistic to expect an illiterate Mexican, likely suffering in extreme poverty, to have the wherewithal to come to, and survive in, this country. I say MY position is FAR more grounded in reality, and YOURS is more grounded in a desire to look down on and demean a people.
It’s striking that you create a false dichotomy between “illiterates” on the one hand, and “engineers, lawyers, dentists, computer scientists, accountants, architects.”
Ever heard of electricians, carpenters, masons, skilled chefs, etc, etc, etc?
No, you don’t use common sense. You use bogusly inflated numbers to bolster your agenda and you use the word “illiterate” like a broad brushstroke.
In short, you’re not credible.
“No reason for skilled workers to defect to America.”
That statement alone shows how unimaginative, out of touch, and stuck-in-the-mud you truly are.
Good enough to take care of your kids and your car and your ass in the hospital, though.
Seriously, is this all some sort of performance art to see how much bile we can take?
Citation for your $4.2 billion in 2010, please. Maybe you are just hallucinating from dropping the wrong news sources.
I’ve represented unauthorized workers whose employers were trying to take advantage of their immigration status to subject them to worse treatment. So it would be most correct to say that I don’t support anyone violating our laws, with some exception for acts of conscience.
Your premises are so twisted and your sources are so bogus that I think that there’s no point in arguing with you. But if other people want to do so, that’s fine.
“You progressives aren’t very tolerant of factual information that conflicts with your weltanschauung.”
LOL! Look who’s talking, Mr. “I won’t acknowledge that the literacy rate in Mexico is 93.4.”
Let me check something out first: cis.org is “Center for Immigration Studies,” motto of “Low Immigration, Pro-Immigrant.”
I wanted you to find me a source, not a biased polemic.
The nice thing about your post is that it gives the lie to the notion that unauthorized residents (what you call “illegal immigrants”) don’t pay federal taxes.
I’d let you come back here under your own name.
Your “truth” is, sadly, often fiction, and sometimes mangled and stretched out of shape.
“Is that accurate data? Who knows?”
Right back atcha, buddy!
All I know is that “Is that accurate data? Who knows?” line is priceless! Absolutely priceless!
I’m hoping you give me an opportunity to use that again in the near future!
The cost of voting a half breed sudo libral is payback to the open boarders advocates.
I’m inclined to trash this comment. Anyone want to speak up for it?
Do you detect any of that “throwing barbs” that you say you want to avoid?
Trash it.
Someone was speaking of illiterates?
*How many illegal immigrants did Reagan give Amnesty to? That was 1986…..almost
20 years ago.