Deborah Tharp, OJ blogger and hero of free speech and medical pot; Righeimer, Costa Mesa City Council's prohibitionist shot-caller; and Orly Taitz, our loose-cannon secret weapon.
Okay now, sit down. This will take some explaining, but it’s worth it.
Of the several wars that the nightmarishly extremist Costa Mesa City Council is waging against its people, one of the more vigorous is its war against the town’s medicinal marijuana dispensaries. You may remember, from earlier in the year, their calling in the Feds to raid and close down dozens of dispensaries, including perfectly law-abiding ones, leading to scenes of “jackbooted thugs” knocking down doors and threatening even a 4-year-old child with their machine guns.
Around the same time, as we related here, KOCI shut down Robert Martinez’ hugely popular radio show “Cannabis Community.” Over the ensuing days the station gave a baffling array of pretexts for this controversial move, sometimes with the assistance of Costa Mesa Minister of Information William Lobdell, but in their initial conversation with Martinez, overheard by several others, they admitted it was due to pressure from City Council.
Now, as the “cannabis community” attempts to qualify a referendum to allow and strictly regulate these important businesses (which council members claim is what they really want) it’s become obvious that behind the scenes the Council is directing, through their pliant attorney Tom Duarte, an unprecedented and unconstitutional campaign of harassment of signature gatherers in an attempt to prevent the measure from qualifying by its July 7 deadline. And that’s the topic of this story.
Ironies of Costa Mesa’s Anti-Pot Jihad
Then-Mayor Monahan at work.
It was jarring and confusing to see this violent crackdown commence while Gary Monahan was still (nominally) Mayor, Monahan the pub owner and known stoner, who used to speak glowingly of the need for plenty of decently regulated dispensaries, and who raked in thousands of campaign contributions from these business owners. A few months later he resigned as Mayor, but as a councilman still votes lockstep with the Council’s real shot-caller, prohibitionist Jim Righeimer.
"Everything but the bong water!" Dana by OC Weekly.
Just as ironic is the fact that the town is represented by Dana Rohrabacher, the most famous stoner in Congress, who brags of “doing everything but drinking the bong water,” and yet is joined at the hip to his former campaign manager Riggy. It’s enough to make people theorize: Are these cynical Republicans only for a legalization that they can control and profit off of? Are some dispensaries being punished to increase profits for politically friendly ones, gangland-style? This is still being looked into.
Another irony is that while Boss Righeimer pushes a new city charter to give himself more power under the rubric of “local control,” he calls in Obama’s Feds to brutally enforce THEIR federal laws in order to get rid of businesses HE doesn’t approve of. Some local pride, some Republican, eh?
The Ballot Measure, and the Yes-Man City Attorney
In response to the closing of the dispensaries, Army vet Robert Martinez, who had just had both his strenuously law-abiding dispensary and his radio show taken from him, undertook to initiate a city referendum, to once again legalize the dispensaries but regulate them strictly. This is actually what some if not all of the Councilmembers have at times claimed they wanted. The measure must get 6000 signatures (plus a safe cushion) by July 7, to get on November’s ballot; at the moment it has a little over 3000.
And now it’s become clear that the city and its police force have a new policy in place, promulgated by the new, pliant City Attorney Tom Duarte and made effective in February right after this referendum was filed, to harass signature gatherers and threaten them with arrest. Already, several professional signature gatherers have left town to avoid jail time, even though their activity – gathering signatures in public places – is protected by the Constitution.
Duarte (artist's conception)
Who is this City Attorney, this Tom Duarte? Costa Mesa’s previous attorney, the very competent and ethical Kim Barlow, left soon after the ascendance of Riggy, because her advice as to what was illegal, what was a bad idea, and what was likely to get the City successfully sued, was not advice Riggy wanted to hear.
Barlow was replaced by this pliant yes-man who greenlights any wild idea of these extremists, has already caused the city to rack up hundreds of thousands in unnecessary lawsuits, and is in way over his head. Tom Duarte is essentially Riggy’s John Yoo, the lawyer who never said no to George W Bush. And he’s come up with a real indefensible policy of limiting Costa Mesans’ free speech, which is just crying out to be struck down.
And then…
Enter Deborah Tharp.
Deborah became a friend of this blog when she ran as the Libertarian assembly candidate against Don Wagner and Melissa Fox two years ago, and wrote a few articles for us. Always a staunch supporter of both the Constitution and marijuana legalization (medical pot saved her husband’s life) she moved to LA last year, and has been making a living as a journalist and a paid signature gatherer – usually for pot measures. (It really helps to be paid to work on something you believe in, and vice versa.)
When she heard what was going on in Costa Mesa, “her old back yard,” she knew she had to get back down there and help this measure qualify. And she’s been all over town, raking in the sigs, but the most fertile ground seems to be Mother’s Market at Newport and 19th.
But the owners of Mother’s, and particularly a manager named Julie, do NOT want signature-gatherers for pot dispensaries in front of their store. This despite their allowing GMO petition collectors access whenever they wanted, even letting them collect inside the store! That was a cause they were on board with. Marijuana dispensaries not so much, despite how stoned many of their employees seem.
And they are obviously aware that they have City leadership and the police force on their side in this. Manager Julie came right out and told Debbie (wrongly) that she was trespassing, and that if she didn’t leave she would call the police. And what did Debbie do? She went right to the police station herself, with the following document she’d prepared (She also gave a copy to the City Attorney Duarte and the owners of Mothers.) The shift captain read it, and was impressed enough to agree not to respond to any calls from Mothers asking them to arrest Debbie. [Update – for a more accurate chronology see Debbie’s comment below.] Here are the most important excerpts, you can read the whole document here.
******************
It has come to the attention of several of the citizens of Costa Mesa that attempts are being made to block the exercise of free speech activities at certain public places.
The definition of public access as defined by the Supreme Court case Pruneyard Shopping Center v. Robins has been narrowly interpreted to block said access of free speech by attempting to limit the definition of what is public property.
We the citizens of California do hereby state that attempts to block free speech in the city of Costa Mesa cease immediately based on the following:
Whether the Pruneyard decision is pertinent to the exercise of free speech activities in California is a moot point as the exercise of free speech is broadly protected by the California Constitution itself.
The California Constitution Article I SEC. 2.(a) states that “Every person may freely speak, write and publish his or her sentiments on all subjects, being responsible for the abuse of this right. A law may not restrain or abridge liberty of speech or press.
The California Constitution Article I Sec. 3 (b) (2) states that “A statute, court rule, or other authority, including those in effect on the effective date of this subdivision, shall be broadly construed if it furthers the people’s right of access, and narrowly construed if it limits the right of access.
And:
Code of Civil Procedure – Section 425.16.
(a) The Legislature finds and declares that there has been a disturbing increase in lawsuits brought primarily to chill the valid exercise of the constitutional rights of freedom of speech and petition for the redress of grievances. The Legislature finds and declares that it is in the public interest to encourage continued participation in matters of public significance, and that this participation should not be chilled through abuse of the judicial process. To this end, this section shall be construed broadly.
…[skipping a lot]…
Your co-operation in allowing the citizens of Costa Mesa to address the public in an open, fair and constitutional matter will be appreciated; any further attempts to block free speech activities in the city of Costa Mesa will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.
*********
A few days later – that’s last Tuesday, June 5 – the Costa Mesa police, under orders from City Attorney Duarte (who in turn acts under orders from Riggy’s council) changed their tune. Debbie was back at Mother’s, and manager Julie called the police, and this time they said that they were under new instructions and that if Debbie came back to gather signatures one more time she would be arrested. Seemingly refusing to grasp the arguments in her above piece, they kept referring to how the Pruneyard decision doesn’t protect her.
Deborah then decided that she WOULD come back and be arrested, if it came to that. She contacted your humble blogger, and she got herself legal counsel. You’re gonna love this part – I told you she also works as a journalist? Well, one of her recent pieces had been a very entertaining interview with Senate candidate/birther/dentist/realtor/attorney Orly Taitz. And it turns out Orly is intensely interested in this issue, not only opposing the Obama administration’s usurpation of states’ rights with their marijuana crackdowns, but actually renting property to a dispensary herself. Who knew? I guess that does make a sort of sense.
Orly agreed that if Debbie was arrested, she would come bail her out the next day, take her case, and talk to the press.
*
YESTERDAY, Thursday June 7. Sue Lester, Bob Martinez, I, and some other sympathizers went down to Mothers, video cameras handy, to watch Debbie do her signature collecting. And damn, she is really good at it. She must have got a few dozen in the hour between when I got there and when the police showed up. The police were friendly and professional and didn’t stop me from filming the arrest:
Technically it was the police assisting in Mother’s making a citizen’s arrest of Deborah for trespassing. The police wrote her a ticket, which she had the option of signing and leaving and going free, or signing and staying and being arrested, or not signing and being arrested. She opted to not sign the ticket and to be arrested. And, as an extra punitive measure, she was taken not to the Costa Mesa jail but to the OC Central in Santa Ana, where she languishes now – a miserable and rough place, I can tell you!
The important thing now isn’t even the marijuana issue, but the fact that the lawless Costa Mesa City Council think they can override the Constitution whenever it suits them. This is just another instance of many, of these men’s boundless arrogance – starting with Righeimer and his OC GOP handlers. Still, we think that the publicity we will get from Debbie’s lawsuit against the city, along with Orly’s involvement, will help us get enough signatures for this vital referendum.
Many in Costa Mesa remember all too well “Coyotl,” the outspoken Latino activist who cost the City so much in legal fees when they tried to censor and sue him back in the Mansoor days. Will Debbie come to be known as the Coyotl of Cannabis? Time will tell…
I’m just letting you know all the background, so you’re not too gobsmacked when ORLY TAITZ appears today on TV, outside the OC Jail, with a newly-released political prisoner for the cause of free speech and medicinal marijuana, and about to go on the warpath against the Costa Mesa City Council. This is fair warning to the rest of you journalists, the Times, the Register, the Weekly, the Voice of OC, the Daily Pilot. Be there! Friday morning, June 8, time to be announced!
This is EXACTLY what November will be about. Do citizens have rights or does the city council determine those rights? Whose side are you on?
Orly Taitz as means to get attention to the issue: effective.
Orly Taitz actually filing motions: demonstrably ineffective.
I haven’t researched the argument about Pruneyard, but based on my recollection of the case and a peep at that letter, I expect that Costa Mesa is about to lose more money to another plaintiff. I suppose that from Riggy’s perspective, it’s OK, though — because it’s not his money.
Costa Mesa will not lose if Orly Taitz is the attorney. Whoever supports Deborah better find her a better attorey – and spokesperson – FAST.
Orly Taitz couldn’t successfully bring ants to a picnic. There has never been a more wildly ineffective attorney in the history of practicing law.
If Orly Taitz is your secret weapon, you might as well run up the white flag now. Easily the World’s Worst Attorney, Taitz recently lost a case in Georgia to an empty chair.
That’s right, an empty chair.
If Ms. Tharp is serious about defending against this, and not becoming a laughingstock in the process, she’d be well-advised to hire an attorney who did not “study” at an online law school, as Taitz did.
I feel yet another lawsuit coming on. Thanks councilmembers! You $@/$s!
*** INTER OFFICE MEMO***
CM Attorney Tom Duarte ESQ. to Jones Mayer
Attention: Billing Dept.
message: You are gonna LOVE this…………!
Wow…very interesting and the follow up info should be excellent. From my very very limited work with the trespassing and citizen’s arrest aspect of it, this is a grey area coming down to the ability to exercise free speech on what otherwise is private property but generally open to the public for use (i.e. the shopping center is privately owned and operated yet the public is allowed to use the property).
You are right when you indicate that the police was simply assisting in the arrest which therefore Mothers’s and the Manager may also be at risk. I am actually quite surprised that Mother’s (the corporation, LLC, or otherwise- the company) allowed its manager to do this as they now are open to a potentially very expensive civil lawsuit. The manager may or may not have deep pockets, but I am sure that Mother’s and its insurance company do. Of course the city also.
Again, from my limited exposure to this, I believe that if someone (i.e. a citizen, the Manager, Mother’s) wants to effectuate the citizen’s arrest, I almost seem to recall that the police have to assist in that process. Obviously, they should be advising them (Mother’s/the Manager) that they may be violating the person’s rights, especially since there was conversation on going about it. The police can be put in a tough position. It then becomes the job of the courts and DA if they want to pursue the charges I believe. Often times, the person who wants them arrested will not want to put themselves in civil jeopardy and will not go through with the arrest and the police simply try to keep the peace until the situation dies down. Ugly regardless.
Should be interesting…good article.
Thanks. There’s a lot I left out for space considerations, which argues for that being a public space. For example, Debbie was right in front of a bulletin board that was covered with political posters (as you can see here.)
Also as mentioned, petition circulators for the “labeling Genetically Modified Food” were allowed to be there with no limitation … because Mothers is specifically sympathetic to that issue. Mothers does always chase off the “Greenpeacers” who solicit money … and Julie kept accusing Debbie of “soliciting” as well, but that’s not at all what she was doing.
It’s funny, while the cops were in the middle of their arrest, a lot more people wanted to come up and sign; it made them curious, and more sympathetic.
Target on Harbor Blvd. almost always has signature gatherers out in front of its doors. It’s very common to see petition gatherers at places where the public gathers in Costa Mesa.
By the way, Mother’s Market had the GMO signature gatherers inside the store. I have seen other signature gatherers outside the store before. I’m assuming the GMO signature gatherers were invited and the other signature gatherers were not invited. That suggests Julie or Mother’s Market went out of there way to single that particular person out.
Mother’s Market has changed over the years. It’s turning into more of a piece of crap corporate MBA run market than the friendly and happy place it used to be. Kind of like how the turd burglars on city council have ruined Costa Mesa.
Months ago, after having gathered GMO-labeling signatures inside Mother’s for some two hours, I left the store and saw, in the parking lot, a CMPD officer ordering a young man who had been gathering signatures in support of medical marijuana dispensaries to get off the property. My first reaction was “HUH?”
Cannabis is such a great anti-inflammatory when pressed like wheat grass, Mother’s Market would no doubt be selling it if it were legal. Cannabis juice gives you a ton of health benefits similar to wheat grass but without the high. Sounds like Julie made a mistake and the CMPD and council have made matters worse. Although Monahan used to be for an individuals freewill to decide what does or does not go into their body, he has since sold out to Righeimer.
I would suggest NOT voting for Monahan, Mensinger, or McCarthy this election unless you would rather have the government make personal decisions for you. With crime up and CMPD staffing levels down, I’d rather have the PD focused on protecting our civil rights rather than violating them. Sad to see the CM city council want more big brother in our lives telling us how to live.
As always the biggest oppressor of the Free Speech, Vern “Gröfaz” Nelson, who is using private property rule, his blog, is calling for free speech disregarding the private property of others.
I am glad that you and your crowd is getting arrested even though that I may consider that a tyranny.
However, when you Gröfaz will follow the constitution others will too.
So far your cool president disregards ruling of the supreme court so it can local government.
Always remember the Golden Rule you bolshevistic moron mongoloid.
What’s the matter, Stanley, is someone oppressing you? Did someone take out your cuss words, sexual fantasies, and insults to Jews and blacks? Now we see the violence inherent in the system. Help, help, I’m being oppressed!
The bumper:
Technically, it was Jews, Blacks, and women, Vern — it was the sexism that got him suspended last time.
It way beyond mere insults. His calling you Hitler (which is the “Gröfaz” reference, for example), remains. It’s the virulent bigotry that gets him in trouble.
That is all legal protected free speech which you are oppressing.
You are Jewish tyrant!…. Golem
“(which is the “Gröfaz” reference, for example)”…….. Hmmmmm
If you would have any education that you would know that the “Gröfaz” was insult to Hitler!
But as psychopathic paranoid bolshevik you have obviously no clue and will yous anything as an excuse to stigmatize everyone around you as bigot and anti-semi.
You are stupid Jew!
If you could read English you’d see that that was a statement noting that you are comparing Vern to Hitler by using the sardonic insult against Hitler with respect to Vern. The presence of the word “which” did not denote a question. The lack of a question mark may have served as a clue.
You’ll have some time off to think about this and related issues, unless Vern intervenes to restore you. Otherwise, so far as I’m concerned, that’s your last comment until further notice.
“Did someone take out your cuss words, sexual fantasies, and insults to Jews and blacks?”………. Hmmmmmm
That is all protected speech you bolshevistic moron mongoloid.
The speech on how to make “Kosher Dills” does not need protection.
However, I am glad that your and yours friends’ free speech is getting arrests.
“An enemy of my enemy is my friend!”
Protected speech from government censorship, sure, but not necessarily on my blog. Go have fun at Pedroza’s place.
“Protected speech from government censorship, sure, but not necessarily on my blog.”……. Hmmmmm
So why are you quoting this?…….antisocial idiot:
The definition of public access as defined by the Supreme Court case Pruneyard Shopping Center v. Robins has been narrowly interpreted to block said access of free speech by attempting to limit the definition of what is public property.
Your blog is public access! ……. same as Mothers’
It does not require membership.
Stanley, this is idiotic even for you.
Would you prefer to have your comments deleted, to have the bigoted parts taken out, or to have all but the rational parts taken out?
And also.
If Stanley stood in front of Mother’s Market insulting blacks, Jews and women, telling people his sexual fantasies, and cussing, he would get thrown out and nobody would complain.
But we’re discussing someone pursuing their democratic rights, getting signatures on a referendum. I wouldn’t censor someone on my blog talking about a referendum even if I didn’t agree with it.
You are not censoring anyone, “Gröfaz”; I am Jewish tyrant!
I have a really funny remark to make about Stanley speaking about his sexual fantasies in front of Mother’s Market, but one should not speak ill of the banned.
While Stanley is correct that this blog is public access, he’s incorrect in assuming that affords him Constitutional free speech protections to say whatever he wants AND THAT THE BLOG HOST CAN’T EDIT OR DELETE HIS COMMENTS. He’s simply wrong about that.
Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, which has been upheld by the courts, affords the publisher of the blog the right to edit and delete comments.
For more, read here;
https://www.eff.org/issues/bloggers/legal/liability/230
I worked at Mother’s for over a decade and Julie was the worst manager I saw. I can see how her power-tripping personality would urge her to do something so stupid. She’s really just a Bitch. But what she thought was the best thing to do to make herself look good, is going to take her down. I hope she gets fired.
Mother’s are you kidding me? I’m not quite sure how you do not support this issue when a majority of the shareholders use Marijuana themselves.
As for the CM City Council, you guys are a bunch of crooks.
I’m not particulary interested in the cannabis issue, but I totally defend their rights to obtain signatures and start a ballot initiative.
Our city council is actually looking for lawsuits to file, it seems. This one will be a huge civil rights violation.
These CC members can’t do anything right!
Deborah should go back to Mother’s and try collecting signatures for non-GMO weed, and see if they are more sympathetic.
Is it possible to find a less frightening picture of Taitz ? She must have been stoned when she chose those cartoon sized eyelashes.
We like to keep you frightened, Demagogue. Your writing sparkles when you are kept on your toes.
“We like to keep you frightened”…..
Vern, I thought you being a Republican was only temporary. Next you’ll want to see my birth certificate.
I noticed the 60s style eyelashes as well. LOL!
I think we should boycott this Mothers location. Contact Mother’s about this Julie person. I plan to call the store and tweet about this and facebook about it. I think I will talk to Miss Julie myself. I was one of the persons gathering signatures for the Label GMOs campaign and no one bothered us and yes, we were invited inside the store. Here’s the phone number and apparently this location is the headquarters.
(714) 549-6400
Julie did have the permission, and acted under the authority, of the owners of that branch. She actually made it clear during the arrest, that it was “Mothers” making a citizens arrest, not “Julie.” (If that’s possible)
Maybe someone can post contact information for the person responsible for giving Julie permission to do what she did on Mother’s Market behalf? Maybe information about who owns it too? Most people say the original owners were really nice but have had less and less to do with it over the years.
This taking it out on Mothers is well and good, but they wouldn’t have been able to make a citizen’s arrest without the co-operation of the police, and the police wouldn’t have co-operated with them if they weren’t instructed that they should by Attorney Duarte, and Attorney Duarte wouldn’t visit the little boys’ room without Riggy giving him the okay. So that’s where to mainly look.
Remember, for a couple of days the cops were swayed by Debbie’s arguments and refused to get involved with Mothers’ attempts at her removal; until they were straightened out again by the City.
That’s true. Good point. I lost sight of the big picture of things.
Police officers are legally obligated to respond to a citizen’s arrest. Typically, they issue a citation and release the arrestee. The police are not to be blamed in this case.
Now, who got Mother’s to call the cops, and why, is another question….
I stand corrected Vern. I will be interested to see what happens when Label GMOs shows up to MM with their education materials in the near future.
50,000 dead Mexican will attest to the fact that smoking pot never hurt anyone.
You have it backwards — prohibiting pot is what helped kill all of those people.
@ Cook:
Or quite possibly 50,000 dead Mexicans will attest to the fact that criminalizing pot:
a) only increases insecurity by providing a large profit for criminal and unregulated enterprises,
b) while denying the health benefits of medical marijuana, and
c) violating the rights of citizens ()protected by their state’s rights vs federal agency prohibitions.
I suppose cook doesn’t think prohibiting alcohol had anything to do with empowering the Italian Mafia. Scary to think there are people out there with such a disturbed view of the world.
Drinking is legal now, it accounts for millions of deaths a year.
The Italian Mafia did not go away with the end of prohibition.
Medical studies / health benefits? Do they show it cures disease, or just that it is not very dangerous to one health by its self?
Let me quote Greg Diamond (out of context)
“..pot is what helped kill all of those people.”
In California you have med marijuana plus personal recreational use has been decriminalized.
The price has not gone down and the criminal activity has not ended.
If the laws against rape, bank robbery, child molestation are repealed then would those crimes cease to exist?
From the top:
(1) Do you think that we should reinstate the 18th Amendment, cook? Why or why not?
(2) At a minimum, it cures loss of appetite, a potentially deadly symptom of some diseases and some treatments such as chemotherapy. That alone should take it off of the federal government’s “Schedule 1.” There are more examples. Have you ever researched this?
(3) You’re proud of quoting me out of context?
(4) The Feds are busting dispensaries right and left and there are still major legal dangers in personal medical use, including loss of livelihood and licenses.
(5) Legally, marijuana use is not “malum in se” (wrong in itself), but “malum prohibitum” (wrong because decreed illegal.) Do you really want to make the same argument about rape, bank robbery, and child molestation? Yes, they would no longer be “malum prohibitum,” but they would still be “malum in se.” Not so with marijuana use, any more than with drinking alcohol.
“(4) The Feds are busting dispensaries right and left”
There are not any Medical dispensaries, just some criminal enterprises masquerading as such.
Several that were raided and closed down, including that of 8-year Army Vet Robert Martinez, followed every rule, crosssed every T, dotted every I, paid taxes for their employees, everything. Now these employees are collecting unemployment insurance. Isn’t that wonderful, in this economy. You don’t know what’s going on in Costa Mesa cook. Santa Ana maybe, but not Costa Mesa.
If they do not comport with the requirements of Prop 215, then that can be addressed through legal processes. If they do, then calling them “criminal enterprises” is aggravated assault on reason, as well as third-degree hyperbole.
I don’t think MJ should be a class I drug and illegal, but it is what it is.
The fed’s are busting the criminals for violating federal drug laws (running a criminal enterprise), whether or not these co-op are following state law, I doubt that they do.
So spending time and effort and money here in California and other states is a waste, changing the laws on MJ requires action by congress, so go talk with your US Senator or Congress person.
“so go talk with your US Senator or Congress person.”
Can’t do it, cook. My Congressman just drank all the bong water.
*”You’ve got trouble…..right here in River City…it starts with P and ends with L and it stands for POOL. You’ve got trouble…..right here in River City…”
Please folks save a click of the keyboard once in a while.
Medicinal Marijuana….should be just that Medicinal….not Recreational. If they are
selling “the demon weed” drugs at Staples or Office Depot……it should be stopped immediately. We are sure it was not a Corporate decision. If it was….close down the
Corporation.
The good thing is that we’re having this discussion, and that the thuggery the CM City Council has been conducting is now coming into the light. We CM residents are fed up with the abuse and misuse of power. These clowns on the council are the most ignorant and arrogant bunch we’ve seen in a long time. It’s time for the tables to turn! Our disgust will be realized in November when we replace everyone we can.
We do not support corruption or violation of citizens’ rights, and that seems to be two things this council and the President’s administration seem to be very cozy with. This latest example has our blood boiling! This has energized so many of our peers to get involved – we will no longer sit back and watch our rights be stepped on by these disturbing characters. Their power needs to be revoked. Bring on the media, let’s turn the lights on and watch the cockroaches scatter!
Vern– I wish you would set this whole weird cast of characters in a special Costa Mesa musical. It could be performed at The Starlight Theater on Victoria, with Stanley in a sandwich board or giant banana costume or something on the corner, selling tickets or gathering signatures…
Special discount for Orange Juice supporters
Special T-shirts
I need a drink!
That’s right around the corner from my house…..I’m in. Although the best show in town is still the Tuesday Night fights at the City hall.
Is it worth the price of admission to go one night?
While I 100% support medical marijuana, I do NOT support this ballot measure.
Had they had included a clause regarding the quality and cleanliness of the product it would be a different story. Most if not all of the ten clinics that have brought this measure to light were hands down some of the worst this industry has to offer.
For the record, Debbie should not have been arrested.
Even if you’re right, getting from where we are to where we should be would be easier following the approval of this measure than without it. And there are other and better ways to get at dispensaries that aren’t doing their jobs well other than wiping out all dispensaries.
Vern, thank you for writing such an amazing story to shed light on the situation. I only had one point to clear up, but it might change the light of the story a bit, so it’s a big point.
I actually didn’t go right away and deliver that notice to the police. What happened was, I had tried to work on the property the Saturday before. Julie came to tell me me leave, I didn’t as usual and she called the police. I decided to cut to the chase so to speak and just go to the station to clear things up. I talked to the watch commander, and he said, that’s fine, if there’s any problem we’ll respond. I said ok, went back to the property and back to work and the manager called the police. A different officer responded, called Tom Duarte to ask his opinion, and Duarte authorized an arrest. The officer told me to leave and I decided in the interest of civility to move to the sidewalk. Naturally, I didn’t get any more signatures because the sidewalk is not generally accessible to the flow of traffic. We decided to call the city attorney and ask for clarification. We got no response after many tries and an entire week of waiting.
I tried other stores in town but they were “burnt out” so to speak after a very tough season of petitioning and the job was not moving along at a quick enough pace to qualify. Seeing that the deadline was now ticking down, this was one of the last stores in town that still has a good response to this issue of public interest after a very busy petitioning season and the police seamed capable of reason, I researched the case law myself and presented that note to them, and the city attorney and the store managers on Thursday night. The rest of the story transpired as the article states.
Vern, you may either publish this comment, or if you would like, just cut and paste it into the article. I tried to write it in a way that would make that easy for you. Thanks and I hope to see you in the next day or two. Time with friends would be therapeutic right now. I am feeling a bit rough after what happened to me following the arrest, in the Orange County Jail. When I talked to you yesterday, I was on the tail end of the sort of adrenaline shock that one gets when they are given the rough treatment for a good 20 hours with no access to food. I am now just sort of spent and feeling low.
Shouldn’t the headline read “MOTHERS MARKET MANAGER PLACES ACTIVIST UNDER CITIZENS ARREST”
I traded at Mother’s when they were on 17th Street and quite liked the place. After the move to the old Border’s Books building, the place seemed to change radically. Most of the clerks were either young and irritable women, who not only didn’t know their stock but who rolled their eyes when confronted with an innocent question put by your 70-year-old correspondent. The others were also young women but apparently blissed-out like career Moonies trying to sell me worthless homeopathic nostrums and equally worthless copper bracelets for my arthritic knees. I returned only a few times, and when I found out the clerks weren’t union I stopped entirely. The hell with them. And as others have advised, I’d send Ms. Taitz a “thank-you, but no thanks” note to her residence on the back side of the Moon and find a bulldog lawyer. I’m sure the ACLU could recommend a dozen or so. They might even take the case themselves.
So now Mother’s Market gets to pick and choose which groups get to gather signatures outside their store? Is Mother’s just following orders? Is Mayor Pro Tem Jim Righeimer really behind this even though he claims to know nothing about it? I will have to light up a doobie and give this some serious thought.
And by the way I bet you as soon as some pharma biz comes up with a way to patent marijuana it will not only be legal, but we’ll see endless television ads singing its praises!
In essence, they already did. It’s called called “Marinol.”
Here’s the government’s pitch for it: http://www.justice.gov/dea/ongoing/marinol.html.
FYI: On October 7, 2003 The United States Government as represented by the Department of Health and Human Services was granted a U.S. Patent (#6630507) on any and all uses and applications of: Cannabinoids as antioxidants and neuroprotectants.
http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=H…
In other words, THE GOVERNMENT ALREADY OWNS THE ORGANIC THC OIL BY FORCE… and now THEY OWN THE SYNTHETIC THC OIL BY PATENT…
Greg, you are correct but Marinol is a poor substitute for the real thing, whether its smoked or edible. I can speak from experience Marinol doesn’t work.
Santa Ana MMJ Initiative Forms Drug Cartel
The medical marijuana dispensary ballot initiative proposed for voter approval is designed to benefit only the dispensaries. Only those dispensaries which are currently operating illegally in the City are initially permitted. The initiative forms a panel to control the pot trade in which dispensaries outnumber City officials 2 to 1. There is no limit to the number of dispensaries that the panel can authorize. There is no requirement that dispensaries be located only in ADA accessible buildings. There is no requirement that that access be made available equally on a citywide basis. There is no enforcement mechanism for regulations that the panel may come up with. There is no representation provided on the panel for residents of Santa Ana.
The Santa Ana Police Dept. is forbidden to contact Federal authorities in relation any drug activities of the dispensaries. The initiative does nothing to safeguard the residents of Santa Ana and does everything to ensure the profitable operations of selling marijuana for the dispensaries. It does nothing more than create a legalized drug cartel within the City of Santa Ana.
That is very interesting skallywag. I will check it out. The issue I am working on is in Costa mesa
Maybe true, maybe not. Let us know if you find anything out. Skallywag IS a foe of legalization, an old “square.”
And you are a dickhead Vern.
Skallywag must like the government telling him how to live his life because he has no idea how. Probably has a fragile ego too and hates things that don’t fit into his narcissistic paradigm. Just a guess…
Hi Debbie – Here is a “Box” cloud doc – I believe that you would need to sign up for a free Box app in order to downlowd the doc.
https://www.box.com/shared/cmmqa1x54se218hx4dlk
The initiative, drafted by dispensary supporters and owners, is highly leveraged to the advantage of the dispensaries. The initiative has no requirement for or enforcement of their so-called “good neighbor” policies. City officials are forbidden from cooperating with Federal officials regarding the operation of marijuana dispensaries, whether they are operating legally or illegally regarding any federal drug laws. There is no requirement that equal and balanced access for those requiring medical marijuana be provided on a citywide basis – 10 of the 20 listed dispensaries are located within a one square mile area of Northeast Santa Ana; and 17 of the privileged 20 are on the east side of town. There is no requirement for ADA access to the dispensary stores.
If it’s that bad, they shouldn’t have written it that way, and will be unlikely to pass.
Still, looking at this again … I got no problem with “city officials forbidden from cooperating with Feds” to prevent the abuses we see in CM. And of COURSE they’re illegal under federal drug law, that’s not a question.
And since when are you so concerned about those last two items – ADA, and equal access in poor neighborhoods? Sounds like you guys are reaching.
skally, other laws don’t go away after you pass an initiative — Santa Ana voters can’t really overrule the ADA, for example — and you can’t actually prevent city officials from talking to Feds without squashing the First Amendment, so I think that you are being alarmist. Your thoughts on how to improve such an initiative are welcome, but let’s bear in mind that the blocking of reasoned efforts towards reform is what may generate less well-reasoned ones, which can still be stepping stones towards more reasonable compromise measures.
Diamond – I am suggesting an augmentation to the ADA. The ADA would stay in place. I would like to see the additional requirement that pot dispensaries in buildings which are not up to ADA – constructed pre-ADA – if those are used as pot dispensaries – that they be brought up to ADA standards regardless of grandfathering. That can be done.
“And since when are you so concerned about those last two items – ADA, and equal access in poor neighborhoods?”
They are legitimate concerns.
And you are not concerned that the drug control panel will be dominated by dispensaries – 14 drug dealers to only 7 city officials?
you do realize though that this issue that is pertinent to the current article is the Costa Mesa petition, not the Santa Ana petition.
It is interesting though, thanks for sending it to me. I have no problem with preventing the feds either.
I realize that the article concerns CM – however, many from SA read the blog and would be interested to learn how this issue is being handled in our city.
Also, the SA initiative forbids the City from contacting the Feds concerning ANY drug activities which could possibly take place at the pot shops – including meth, heroin, speed – you name it. Do you think that is a good thing?
I want to know where the real patients are on this issue, why haven’t any of them stepped forward on this issue? All I hear is different people trying to use her as a political pawn. She believes in this issue from past experience, I didn’t want to get involved in all of this but the way she has been treated makes me involved as a husband and Father.
My wife saved my life, I went through kidney failure 10 years ago and she was there for me and our children, she gave up a good job, only to make 10 bucks an hour so she could be by my side as I was slowly dying. We had a great life together in Dallas, TX, only to be cut short from my birth defect. Since I met her she has been 100% about helping people, to the fact that it really made me angry at times. But the more i got to know her, the more I loved her. She is out to save the world and at times i was resentful,
She came from modest family in Missouri and I grew up in a poor community in L.A. I grew up knowing that you make yourself and do not let anyone get in the way. I made so many mistakes along the way that I sill regret to this day. I decided that it was time for change so I got on a plane and moved, still leaving regrets, my son and Family. I was lucky enough to stick my arm up and hail a cab so I could get to to work.
Lo and behold their she was, the person I needed in my life and it was obvious I was the person she needed. That was the day I met Debbie. She taught me to be me, not someone that I thought I should be but a man, I was 28 years old and trying to succeed. With her help and the love we found with one another, we found that American Dream (lol).
And we did! We bought that first house, worked hard, got married, had our beautiful son together and then it ended. End Stage Renal Disease finally caught up with me. I had 1/3 of a kidney my whole life. That is hard enough to deal with, let alone telling the girl you just met and knowing you want to be with her for the rest of your life. She never showed any fear all she did was love me.
It got to the point that we lost everything but each other. I tried to work , while doing dialysis, staying home with our son while she was on the road driving her big rig. It became clear it was about me being alone while my brother watched my son and Deb, holding my hand in my final days. We lost our home, all our possessions, but we had love.
Long story short we moved to Central California to get some help from my family. She figured out that the only way for us to survive was her going back to school, and she did it! She watched my health decline for quite a while, till it got so bad that I was finally dying. She did everything she could to keep me alive, finding doctors who who would take a chance, just to see If I could be saved.
I was at dialysis and she she came in with my new Doc, a guy named Dr. Niscko. It was the fist meeting he and I had. I had the needles put in to my fistula, got my meds and went straight into cardiac arrest. My wife gave me mouth to mouth till the ambulance showed up. That was my first cardiac arrest. I went into a coma right after that, having a total of 32 and dying 3 times, while she never left my side.
I came home with a pacemaker, wishing I could eat. one of my buddies at dialysis looked at me and said, you know your’e dying right? I said yes. I gave my oldest son up for adoption because I knew he was right. The day I went to the adoption ceremony was the most painful day of my life. I knew it was over, but what I didn’t say was that guy talking to me said, you gotta smoke weed, it will help. I did not want to because I didn’t want to be a bad example for my boys.
I talked it over with Debbie my Mom and the entire family. I was ready to die so I wouldn’t be a a bad influence on my boys. I was weighing about 87 pounds at the time, I knew I was going to die. Debbie, my Mom, my Dad all said don’t think about the past, think about the future. Marijuana saved me from a slow death. I still could not get a transplant due to all me complications, yet Debbie watched as I gained weight, was able to get out of my wheelchair, she was relentless about getting me a transplant. Well she did find a place to get it for and for that I am truly thankful.
Thank you, Debbie, I know walk around town, pick our sons up from school with your kidney inside my body. If it wasn’t for medical marijuana, my son would not have been at the circus with his friends today. Before you scorn my wife, think about what you would do for your husband, wife, mother, child. This issue is about patients rights, a pill is not always the cure, I tried em, got addicted, and lost a couple years and dealt with being sick instead of being well.
Anyone who reads this, it is not a sappy story, it is a true one, I am alive because Debbie put me me and our family in front of all her dreams. You might not agree with all the things she writes, and I don’t either. I know she cares and I’m alive because of her. so when you lay judgment on this blog, know, I’m alive our children are doing well and that kidney she gave me wakes me up every day.
I love Deb.
@ Don T:
Debbie sounds like she is an angel . . . on earth!
stay well.
Paco
Hi Don. Thanks for sharing and for the vital insight into Debbie’s character. I hope you don’t consider me one of those “people using her as a political pawn.” I just want the same thing she wants (I think) and to help her do it – to change the free speech policies of the City and Mothers, and to qualify this vital initiative.
Don’t listen to the crazy hateful voices out there.
I have no problem with medical marijuana – but the laws and regs we have now are abused and are a joke.
And I will add that until state law is amended, in order to reign in the abuse, the only recourse many cities have is to ban the dispensaries.
“Rein in,” good buddy, like the reins of a horse, not the reign of a king. Don’t feel bad, everyone’s starting to spell that wrong and I’m just trying to stem the tide.
Yu shoud outa ignoar miner speling en grammatrical errers en stik two da con-tent of da commentaterers komint.
Well I obviously disagree with your content, but I’m not gonna beat a dead horse when I could take it by the reigns.
Prop 215 is the law. So you favor cities’ violating the law? I don’t think that any blanket ban on dispensaries is legal. Many of them have perfectly fine records.
If cities are violating the law – then take ’em to court. You da lawyer man.
You don’t think that cities following the law is a better practice than my making money off of them as plaintiff’s counsel? I do.
A source, WHO WOULD KNOW, writes me:
“Hey Vern, sorry for the delay. Officers have a lot of discretion when it comes to most arrests. It’s not necessarily something that is directed by he Watch Commander or field supervisor. In fact most officers wouldn’t even involve a supervisor unless there was some potential liability involved.
“Now, I don’t know any particulars about this case. So much happens in the city day to day that it can e tough to know all the calls that were handled. However, from what I read and what you are asking; it could be possible that Deborah was told she was correct in her assertion of the Pruneyard decision and that she would not be arrested based on that case law. I do know there has been opinion circulating about that case and a decision was pending. Most of that has been driven by legal counsel for some of the larger property owners (e.g. Target).
“If a person chooses to make a private person’s arrest (I hate “citizen’s arrest” because you don’t have to be a citizen), an officer does have to accept it. Now, what we do from there is based on our discretion an what he law says. We can cite and release at the scene (for misdemeanors) or book at the jail.
“In all cases the arresting person (private party) has to sign a form that says they are making the arrest and assume all liability for it. We normally require them to prepare a written statement too.
“The city council does not normally have direct input into policy. Of course they drive policy, but implementation should be the discretion of the chief. The city attorney has quite a bit of input on the other hand. We base a lot of our policy based on case law and he certainly provides legal opinion based on court decisions.”
*********
Reading that, I see that he admits City Attorney Duarte has “quite a bit of input” into police policy. And we do know from observation – it’s pretty undisputed – that Duarte, more than most City Attorneys, is a yes-man and facilitator to the Council and Righeimer. So it does follow that the Council INDIRECTLY does have quite a bit of input.
Another detail I mentioned that’s sort of fallen through the cracks is that on the police’s penultimate visit to Deborah at Mothers, two days before the arrest, they were holding in their hand a document (decision? ordinance?) they had just got from Duarte, that was dated mid-February (i.e., right after this initiative was filed.) I need to look into this more, as does Deborah and whoever’s gonna be representing her.
Later, he (or she) wrote:
“I just read the updates. Your summary is very complete. Better than the Pilot would ever give. At least you give some legal background. Understand, the officers have to accept that arrest.”
and, interestingly:
“The reason she we to to OCJ was because there is no provision for housing females at CMPD.” Oh. OK. Duh! So that bit wasn’t punitive then.
I love you Donny.
For the record, there was no need to house me at all. This is a civil dispute.
I really really love you Donny. I am so glad I met you too. Your love has made me who I am today. 100%
And I would do it all again.
🙂
Aww… get a blog you two.
🙂
If Debbie chooses a jury trial (which I hope she does) I will be glad to testify that I gathered signatures for the GMO petition a couple of months ago at Mother’s Costa Mesa and was inside the store, along with others (we worked in shifts) and Julie made copies for me regarding GMO information.
Let’s show up at the next City Council meeting and ask Jim Righeimer what is going on. He claims to not know anything about this. I’m going. Anyone else?
Tuesday, June 19, 2012
6:00 PM – City Council Meeting
Greg Diamond:
“You don’t think that cities following the law is a better practice than my making money off of them as plaintiff’s counsel? I do.”
Your’re probably right Greg – your clients would just blow their disability money on gonja anyway.
What an uneducated and uncalled-for thing to say about my clients.
If this is your way of admitting that your previous comment was wrong, thanks — but please try to be clearer next time.
I can see how you would interpret that in a manner which I did not intend – sorry about that.
I was refering to fake claims of disability to obtain weed and benefits.
I don’t handle fake claims of any kind.
I don’t know what type of claims that you handle – it was a joke – but not a very good one.
Thank you MIKA. We will definitely contact you shortly.
I’ll hook you guys up with her real name, phone and e-mail which you probably don’t have.
This does not at all surprise me as I was just denied any affirmative defense in my Medical Marijuana Trial, I am a Patient, caregiver, and Collective operator, With A Valid Rec, State I.D. and State Caregiver card as well as formed a Non-Profit and have a sellers permit…
It is not just Costa Mesa but all of Orange County.. The D.A.s, Prosecutors and Lawyers from Certain Cities are on a Crusade against California’s Sick and Hurting.. Who are they Protecting? Not the Patients, Not the Citizens? Who?
If this is the kind of help we should keep on expecting in California from those there to Protect and serve us, What do we do when we need help?
HUNG JURY TODAY in Orange County California on Jason D. Andrews Medical Marijuana case.. HELL YEA!! With the Judge denying any Medical Marijuana Defense.. Chris Glew is my Attorney… Great job..
Debbie, is it possible for you to please list the ten or so collectives represented in the Costa Mesa initiative?
I would probably direct that question more to Robt Martinez or Sue Lester, who have been involved locally much longer.
Why? Is this some kind of trick question?
Vern, I don’t know Robt Martinez nor Sue Lester and I do not recall a post by either of them.
One would think Debbie should be able to answer the question unless of course she is blindly gathering signatures. No trick question I just prefer the WHOLE story as opposed to the parts either side would like us to hear.
Debbie didn’t write this post either. I did. I’ll ask Bob or Sue that question. but I have a feeling you already know the answer?
If you read it carefully you will see the initiative is not limited to the collectives listed but the ones listed are as follows:
Herban Elements
American Collective
Tri County PA
Newport Mesa PA
Newport Blvd Med Center
Marijuana County Collective
Simple Farmer
Otherside Farms
Live Well
3rd Eye Healing Center
The initiative calls for the same regulations any other business would have when it comes to parking and land use, but adds security alarms and cameras. Also states that clubs must be run according to attorney general guidelines, ie not for profit.
The initiative also DEREGULATES your home grow of 3 patients or less.
And maybe most importantly prohibits the city from colluding with feds.
CITIZEN’S ARREST: A private person cannot make a citizen’s arrest or request police assist in a citizen’s arrest absent a felony crime punishable by a prison sentence.
CA PC 837.
As, for example, humorist and poet Calvin Trillin, who detests mimes, is always having to be restrained by his wife from placing mimes under citizen’s arrest.
837. A private person may arrest another:
1. For a public offense committed or attempted in his presence.
2. When the person arrested has committed a felony, although not
in his presence.
3. When a felony has been in fact committed, and he has reasonable
cause for believing the person arrested to have committed it.
Why doesn’t #1 apply?
http://www.dailypilot.com/news/tn-dpt-0613-taitz-20120612,0,6578658.story
Serna scooped ‘ya…..on the Taizt response that is….
I was about to bitch that these print reporters NEVER credit the bloggers like us who beat them to the story by DAYS … but I see that Serna did. Sorta.
This must be the Pilot story that my police source was comparing us to so … FAVORABLY.