Trung Nguyen has found his inner racist – as did his predecessor Tan Nguyen. Kudos to Red County/OC Blog writer Mark Leyes for posting Nguyen’s highly inflammatory mailer today. Nguyen actually brags about standing at the Mexican border, like a Minuteman, to “stand watch.” Way to throw gasoline on relations between O.C. Vietnamese and Latinos Trung! The mailer is simply disgusting. See images below, courtesy of Red County/OC Blog. Shame on Lynn Daucher for supporting this guy. I thought she was better than that.
Clearly Latino voters need to wake up and smell the coffee. If every Latino voter votes for Benny Diaz, these racist candidates will be rebuffed.
I don’t care how many feel good meetings you have between Vietnamise and Latinos…this campaign is increasing the hate between them and I don’t see it going away any time soon.
Where is he standing? Is that the Ho Chi Mien ttrail?
Art, are you in support of the things he is apparently opposed to – drivers licenses for undocumented people, same with healthcare, etc? Just want to understand where you are coming from —-
Poster 3,
What irks me about this mailer is the transparent effort by Trung Nguyen to convince white voters to support him by using Latinos as his scapegoats. It is race-baiting at its worst.
I favor giving green cards to Latino immigrants who have been here for over 5 years without causing trouble – provided they have been working. I think they should pay a fine for having come here illegally. But why not let them work? I do not favor amnesties.
With regard to licenses, we have a problem in California. There are a lot of hit and runs because people are driving without licenses. Giving these folks green cards should help, as they can then get licenses. Otherwise we need to resolve this issue somehow. It is messing up everyone else’s insurance rates.
The healthcare issue is a difficult one. We are paying anyway as our healthcare system is subsidized by the government. I have not looked that closely at the Arnold plan but it does bear further scrutiny. It sounds like a tax on businesses though, and that I do not support.
Bottom line – we are facing real problems – but Trung is not interested in solving them. He just wants to inflame both sides. That is a dangerous strategy.
I think Art should change his first name to Coyotl and re-register as a Democrat.
Candidates would not be using this issue if there weren’t polling data showing that it resonates with probable voters. It was used successfully in Congressional elections, as well as some State and local elections around the country this last cycle, by both Rep’s & Dem’s, and this issue is one that is ripping apart the Republican Party. Look at the comments being made about the new RNC Chairman and where the RNC may be headed.
Is it race baiting or scapegoating when it correctly identifies the problems and the population causing the problems? Maybe. But look at your proposed solutions. While they are very sound and logical, every one of them gives a reward to the illegal population because they got here and are now impacting the lives of everyone here legally. There are a lot of people, including many Hispanics, or Latino’s or whatever the p.c. term is, that don’t believe in the “if you get here illegally, you get the rewards” mentality. And look at the mentality of some of those who are here illegally. We’re here and now it’s our RIGHT to do this or have that. Is that race baiting?
California and some of the other South West states are the bell weather of what’s going to happen across the country as that population continues to move around, and many people don’t want their State to be in the same position our State is in.
Everything you said above about green cards, licenses and health care issues is correct. We are at a point where we either include this entire population or **we’re** screwed. And either way, the taxpayers are picking up the tab. There are a lot of people who deeply resent being in this position and, right or wrong, that’s why candidates are using the issue and why it’s playing very well in some locations.
Poster 6,
Bottom line – you can talk about these problems rationally or you can inflame people by sending out mailers with pictures of barbed wire and Trung Nguyen standing watch at the border. The man is not trying to solve problems he is just scapegoating Mexicans. That is not right and I suspect it will backfire on Nguyen, as it should.
I do realize that immigration has been identified as a big issue, by GOP pollsters. But OC Supervisors have little to do with this federal issue. Nguyen has no clue what Supervisors do, so instead he is focusing on Wilsonian tactics. It won’t help. On Feb. 6 he will lose, but the damage wrought by his mailers will live on ad infinitum.
As a Vietnamese, I’m disgusted when I see Vietnamese politicians use issues like immigration to this extreme for political leverage.
I have no doubt that if Vietnam bordered the U.S. when the communist took over, that there would be an influx of illegal Vietnamese crossing the border as well. So, who are we to judge???
Yes, we got here legally, but only after we entered illegally into countries like Malaysia, Thailand, Philippines, Singapore, and was only offered refuge in those places when the world opened their hearts to the Vietnamese people, and, after that, countries like the U.S./Australia/France/Canada/etc. showed us compassion, sympathy, and love. SO WHO ARE WE TO JUDGE!!!
The bottom line, it doesn’t matter how someone got here. It’s why they came here. It’s the opportunity that America offers. It’s the dream that your children can grow up to have a life of hope and happiness, to control their own destiny. A kid growing up in a dictorial Vietnam with no hope and opportunity is the same as a kid growing up in Venezuela under Hugo Chavez with no hope and opportunity.
There are so many similarities between a Vietnamese and Latino. So I ask the question, why does there seem to be this conspiracy to pin our communities/peoples against one another? Is someone fearing our collective strength?
Back to the issue…
I’m not denying that we have an immigration issue, nor am I advocating for an open-door policy. But let’s strategize on a comprehensive solution to this problem, rather than patronizing one group of people, or worse yet, as CL infered, pinning one ethnic group against one another for self-interested ideological reasons.
Just because Tan Nguyen, Trung and Janet used this issue to appeal to a certain group of voters, I hope this mentality doesn’t reflect on the entire Vietnamese community. MOST OF US DO NOT FEEL THIS WAY!
Poster 8,
Bravo! You are very wise. Thanks for contributing to this discussion. I could not agree more.
As a Vietnamese, I’m disgusted when I see Vietnamese politicians use issues like immigration to this extreme for political leverage.
I have no doubt that if Vietnam bordered the U.S. when the communist took over, that there would be an influx of illegal Vietnamese crossing the border as well. So, who are we to judge???
Yes, we got here legally, but only after we entered illegally into countries like Malaysia, Thailand, Philippines, Singapore, and was only offered refuge in those places when the world opened their hearts to the Vietnamese people, and, after that, countries like the U.S./Australia/France/Canada/etc. showed us compassion, sympathy, and love. SO WHO ARE WE TO JUDGE!!!
The bottom line, it doesn’t matter how someone got here. It’s why they came here. It’s the opportunity that America offers. It’s the dream that your children can grow up to have a life of hope and happiness, to control their own destiny. A kid growing up in a dictorial Vietnam with no hope and opportunity is the same as a kid growing up in Venezuela under Hugo Chavez with no hope and opportunity.
There are so many similarities between a Vietnamese and Latino. So I ask the question, why does there seem to be this conspiracy to pin our communities/peoples against one another? Is someone fearing our collective strength?
Back to the issue…
I’m not denying that we have an immigration issue, nor am I advocating for an open-door policy. But let’s strategize on a comprehensive solution to this problem, rather than patronizing one group of people, or worse yet, as CL infered, pinning one ethnic group against one another for self-interested ideological reasons.
Just because Tan Nguyen, Trung and Janet used this issue to appeal to a certain group of voters, I hope this mentality doesn’t reflect on the entire Vietnamese community. MOST OF US DO NOT FEEL THIS WAY!
I am not a racist but I believe that Latinos have limited IQ.
Art, this is to follow up on your no. 4 and my no. 3. I agree that the current situation is a mess. I also feel there is no solution that will not inflame a large number of people – this is perhaps why our Congress won’t deal with it. Some of us who were around in 1987 when the federal Immigration Reform and Control Act (IRCA) was enacted and saw 10% of Orange County’s population seek amnesty at that time (about 220,000 people out of a population then of 2.2 million), said that the problem will not go away unless we did something to control the borders. The answer given in that legislation was to hold employers accountable for NOT hiring undocumented persons – and we all know how that (didn’t) work. So, today we have a mess and no relatively painless way out. I suspect that the people who tend to vote, a small percentage of our population, are sympathetic to the anti-illegal immigrant rhetoric but have no viable solution to the current situation either. As to the racially divisive nature of the campaign literature, this is the same problem I have had with some of the posts on this site over the last few weeks. I do not think it constructive to talk about one ethnic group vs. another, but it will probably continue, unfortunately. Seems to be somewhat embedded in our country’s history.
Poster 11 (Stanley),
Really? So what do you have to say about Czechoslovakians who pose as Latinos? What sort of mental problems do they have?
Latinos have just as much potential as anyone else. For you to say otherwise is indeed racist.
#11
You’re just stupid.
Post #11 (Stan Fiala) . You have made this atatement many times before.What scientific journal did you read this at?It is interesting you feel this way but choose to marry a Mexican,and by your belief have children with limited IQ’s.I believe you have the limited IQ and it has nothing to do with your race.
Poster 8: “The bottom line, it doesn’t matter how someone got here. It’s why they came here” (I.E. It doesn’t matter that they broke US Laws to suck up California taxpayer dollars)
Art Pedroza Says:
1/21/2007 5:00 PM
Poster 8,
Bravo! You are very wise. Thanks for contributing to this discussion. I could not agree more.
That about sums about Mr.Pedroza in three sentences. A Republican fraud.
Poster 16,
That’s rich. Bustamante votes for eminent domain. He spends taxpayer money like a drunken sailor. He follows Democrat Pulido around like a lost puppy. He tells labor leaders that he supports PLAs. But I am the fraud?
Where in the GOP by-laws does it say we have to be racists? If you follow the Wilsonian path you will doom our party forever. Even now it might be too late. Look at what happened to our conservative candidates in the last election. Only the squishes survived.
So should we become a slightly more conservative version of the Dem party? No. But we need to be careful in how we present our ideas. Sending Trung to the border is highly offensive. It serves only to drive Latinos to the left. Mission accomplished Trung. Thanks for destroying our party’s future in Orange County.
Pedroza, to claim sufficient IQ/Intellect a Latino, include yourself, must know that there is no country with the name “Czechoslovakia”.
“destroying our party’s future in Orange County.” ??? Does that mean you think the future of the Rep’s is based on embracing illegals and providing them with citizenship and benefits? Do you really believe that pandering to any group who breaks the Law of our Country is the future for either party? God help us, if that’s true.
The State of California is going broke trying to service this population and our Rep Governor is looking to take us down that path even faster. Our Rep President is embracing another amnesty. Do we really want our future in this country to depend on which party can bend over further for illegals? Is that what politics have come to?
Maybe it’s time for a real revolt by all the Rep’s and Dem’s who are sick of this. Maybe we need a leader with the courage to tell it like it is and take a stand. Yes, I know… it’s wishful thinking. But I can at least hope!
is anyone interested in joinging a recall effort on candidates who have used this immigration issue to divide our communities? i am going to look into this process and go forward with it. I would need some volunteers to canvass community events and public venues for signature gathering.
http://www.Paul Lucas2006.com
What about the newspapers, tv news folks, political pundits and all the rest that talk about this issue? Shall we “recall” them too?
City Councils have the choice about using ICE on a local basis, the BOS will have a choice about medical care for adult illegals under the Gov’s proposed program and voters want to know where candidates stand on this issue.
This is an ISSUE that people care about passionately on both sides; it affects their lives. It about Hispanics here because the majority of people coming in illegally here are Hispanics. If they were Brits or Danes or Germans, the conversation would be the same and Hispanics would be joining in. Get over it!
Much talk is being thrown around in regards to responsibility and breaking the law relative to illigal immigration.The discussion is entirely one sided as far as who to blame.Consider looking at the issue in another way ,where blame can be spread around.The North American Trade Agreement has presented an opportunity to the U.S.A. with access to import products into Mexico.This ability has resulted in the destruction of some of Mexico’s industries that are responsible for a significant source of employment.For example, with the help of government subsidies the U.S.A.’s dairy,avocado and corn industries have destroyed these same Mexican industries.This has produced mayor unemployement in parts of Mexico where these industries were located.The U.S.A. industries through technology and government subsidies undersold the these Mexican industries resulting in their failure.The U.S.A industries then recruit the unemployed Mexicans to work in the U.S.A at low wages.These employers pay smugglers to bring the workers into the U.S.A. , then deduct their wages to pay for the smuggler.The government and big business produce the illegal migration.Most of big business responsible for this migration is very involved in government,so it is ironic that big business support politicians that turn this issue into a political tool in order to incite voters with diverse agendas relative to illigal immigration.Some agendas are economic,racists ,political or cutural phobia.Ojective individuals can see this , others can not handel the truth.If you,we,the U.S.A.is largely responsible for the cheap labor migration then we should take some of the responsibility for the social ills associated with this migration.Beating up on the Immigrant only is hipocritical and intellectualy dishonest.Politicians in particular on this matter stink and should be ashamed of manipulating this issue just to get elected to office.
Mr. Lomeli,
Once again you bring fact and reason to a discussion. You’re right. Government and big business did create this problem to some extent and our elected officials either helped create this mess or turned a blind eye to what’s going on. Now,once again, they won’t fix the problem, so they are going to throw more money at it via another anmesty and benefits. But we had a similar problem before NAFTA, and that was allowed to grow, unchecked. And the fixes being proposed now will not stop this problem. They will only encourage more and more people to come to the U.S. because it’s become the land of “the government (taxpayers) will take care of you”.
As much as I hate to agree with Pedroza, he’s right about not having a lot of choice about what to do now. We either bring these folks into our system or continue to pay the price anyway. What frosts me is, there is no end to this problem. The government will never take the steps necessary to fix it. Twenty years ago we took 3 million illegals and offered them citizenship. They said the problem would be fixed by policing employers. Today there are another 12-13 million waiting for their turn, the government has not and will not police employers because of corporate interests. To make matters worse, this group is DEMANDING their RIGHT to be legalized and to benefits. When I heard them demand inclusion, and saw them carry the Mexican flag as they demanded that we take them in, I lost all sympathy for them. If we go through yet another “inclusion”, then what? Ten or fifteen years down the road will there be another x million also demanding their rights? And please don’t think this is anti-Hispanic. I wouldn’t care if they had been Canadians carrying the Canadian flag. It’s the principal, not the race.
In Florida, there is the same problem with the Cuban “crisis” and the “wet foot/dry foot” policy. Florida is also suffering the same stress on their economic, health care and educational systems. Recently I had a visit from a friend who lives in Switzerland. She’s a school teacher. She told me about all the economic refugees pouring into Switzerland. She spoke of the same exact problems there, as we have here. Their (socialized) health care system is at the breaking point. Education has gone down the drain. Housing stock is overcrowded and deteriorating at an alarming rate. Their welfare system is ready to break. And the answer put forth by their government is, raise taxes on the working class to pay for the poor, the illegals and anyone else who can’t or won’t be responsible for themselves. Which is no different than the answers proposed by our government.
We’ve have worked all our lives for the little bit we have. We’ve never taken a penny of government money and we even worked two jobs each, when we had to. We struggled to pay for health insurance when we could hardly afford groceries. We made certain our children attended and did well in school, even if it meant we had to work with them every evening and weekend to help them with their studies. We knew where our children were, who their friends were and what they were doing. We did not rely on or expect the government to pay for or be responsible for us or our children in any way.
My Grandparents came (legally) from Eastern Europe before there was welfare, SSI, food stamps or other government programs. They came without money and not speaking English. They worked hard, they learned the language, they never asked for or expected bi-lingual anything or any government assistance. They only had the number of children they could afford to take care of, they stressed education and we were not allowed to fail or drop out of school. They taught us to obey the laws of this land and to respect the opportunity we were given by being good citizens. They taught us that it was our obligation to take care of our family. They raised their children and grandchildren with the same values, and we’ve passed on those values to our children and grandchildren.
Now, my children and grandchildren live in a world where people come from different countries, legally and illegally, and expect us to offer them every handout imaginable and to do it in THEIR language. Although they are required to learn English to gain citizenship, we MUST provide voter information in many different languages. Education, drivers licence tests and a host of other things are all required to be offered in multiple languages, lest someone be cheated out of their RIGHT to obtain these things. And people who have broken our basic immigration laws now march in our streets, carrying the flag of their homeland, demanding their RIGHTS! How do I explain this to my grandchildren? How do I try to instill good values in them when they see these people being rewarded for breaking our laws. How do I explain why they will have to pay the price for a group of people who came here outside our laws and can’t afford to pay for their needs or the needs of the children they have chosen to bring into this world? How do I instill in my grandchildren the need to work hard, pay their own way and be responsible for the choices they make?
Why is this such a hot button issue around the country? Because there are millions and millions of people, just like us, who were raised by a generation of immigrants who were grateful for the opportunity to come to this country, learn the language and take responsibility for their own needs and the needs of the families *they* created. And those people, like us, deeply resent the “I’m here and I demand my rights (in my own lauguage)” attitude of this new group of immigrants. Will I be branded by some here as racist for my comments. Of course. Or an elitist who has no sympathy for the poor. Sure. But perhaps *you* Mr. Lomeli will understand what I’m talking about and why so many of us feel as we do.
Post # 23. It seems we agree on the government and big business being largely responsible for the Immigrant migration.The migrant presence is entirely due to a market for their services.This is not argueable.These workers do not come here because the U.S. has become the land of “government(taxpayers) will take care of you”.They come here to work, because people offer them employment .Various public and private agencies have found that the Illegal immigrant community uses insignificant public resources.Hispanics as a group use the least amount of public resources.This community has a solid work ethic and totally embraces the American dream as many other Immigrant groups do.It is my observation that possibly these individuals work for this dream harder than our children do.You missed my main point.My main point was that the U.S. has some responsibility for this migration.Posibly that is why the president and others offer help, that some like yourself, perceive as taxpayer hand outs and nothing more.You refocussed on your perceived bad behavior of this group.The marches you refer to were an attempt on their part to have the citizens acknowlege their positive service to this country.You read as beign very angry and it seems to me that this anger clouds your ability to more objectively address this issue.To do this you must aknowledge your government’s and your neighbor’s involvement in the recruitment of low wage labor.Leaders suggesting taking some responsibility for this problem would not cause so much anger.
He looks like a vietnamese Mr. McGoo.