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This post is written at the suggestion of our commenter Kenlaysnotdead — a sentiment that I suspect, by the way, to be true — at the bottom of the comments section of this New Santa Ana thread — who wants to know why I don’t cover local Brea issues. The answer to that is that for the most part I’m a happy camper (actually a happy renter) here in my multi-ethnic corner of my lovely city and, as a Democrat, I’m not going to have a lot of say in what the Council does anyway. But KLND, as I’ll call him, does raise an interesting story, so I checked it out, and this is what I found.
[UPDATE, 1/3/12: WARNING TO THE READER, BEFORE YOU CONTINUE. THIS HAS NOW PRETTY MUCH BEEN CERTIFIED AS THE MOST BORING ORANGE JUICE BLOG STORY EVER. VERN’S RECAP OF 2011 STORIES IS MUCH MORE INTERESTING AND YOU SHOULD EITHER READ IT FIRST/INSTEAD OR USE IT TO CLEANSE YOUR MIND AFTER YOU FINISH THIS. THE ONLY THING THAT CAN POSSIBLY SALVAGE THIS STORY IS THE TWIST NEAR THE END REGARDING HOW IT CAME TO BE WRITTEN AT ALL. PLUS THERE’S A MEETING YOU CAN GO TO TONIGHT IF THIS SOMEHOW AROUSES YOUR INTEREST DESPITE EVERYTHING. CONTINUE AT YOUR OWN RISK.]
The goad to write this story
As KLND reported to me, the City of Yorba Linda (“YL”) is considering breaking its long-term contract with the Brea Police Department (“BPD”) to cover police services in YL. It would switch to receiving service from the Orange County Sheriff’s Department “OCSD.” A spokesbeing for either the OCSD or the Association of Orange County Deputy Sheriffs (“AOCDS”) — I’m not sure which, because I was given the acronym “AOCSD,” but there doesn’t seem to be an Association of Orange County Sheriff’s Deputies, which you have to admit would be awfully confusing — is being brought on board to catapult the propaganda for the county services. Breans (at least two of them) are apparently coming unglued — or, as we say here in light of our name, untarred — over the prospect of losing the services contract.
In fact, let me share with you KLND’s actual triple push for my coverage here:
[1] Diamond, On a side note, I had lunch in North County today, where a couple of Breans were coming unglued about the rumor of the OCSD taking over police services in Yorba Linda. In a wierd string of commonality, the news spokesperson for the AOCSD name came up as being brought on to help the propaganda war.
What does this mean for Brea, Yorba linda and the county at large. Maybe worth giving Brea Councilmember [Ron] Garcia a call, I think he was a holdout on the Fire thing???
[2] Greg, I would expect you as a Brean to write about the subject, Chris P as a Union Steward (for PUBLIC EMPLOYEES)to write about it, you both are passionate and in this case have “skin in the game”.
As far as it being a rumor: http://www.ocregister.com/news/city-325283-council-linda.html
This I found after tyoing YL POLICE into Google, I also saw links to a website, where people were offered lawn signs and asked to call thier local officials.
Maybe it was a rumor, because as we all know, the OCR can’t be trusted to report facts! (joke)
FOX NEWS gets a lot of shit deservedly for thier “Fair and Balanced” reporting deal. I would just like to see stakeholders put some attention into thier own local stories like they do Santa Ana’s. then it would be a little more believable.
[3] [T]he aforementined BPOA (Brea’s Police Union), which is lead by Triggerman Shawn Neel, the guy who gunned down the unarmed suspect last summer is leading an effort today calling residents and going door to door pusing the agenda.
On the other side, the AOCSD is getting ready to launch an offensive (competing bid).
This would be worthy of mention in an article.
Like KLND, you may wonder: “What does this mean for Brea, Yorba Linda and Orange County at large?” My suspicion is that it is bad for the BPD, good for the OCSD, and probably good for YL for the two service providers to get into a bidding war. But let’s not stop there. Let’s get into the story itself!
The basic facts … and more!
According to this story from the Orange County Register of Santa Ana, which is excellent and informative and which you should read for the basic facts, Yorba Linda is negotiating another extension for the police services contract that it has had with the City of Brea since 1970. Yorba Linda is happy with the service, but not the price, so it in November it gave BPD 18 months’ notice that it may terminate. The OCSD would certainly consider taking on the account, which is set to expire on June 30 (presumably 2013.)
This dramatic interchange gives you much of what you need to know about the personae involved:
“Give us the opportunity before you pull the trigger on 42 excellent years of service,” Police Chief Jack Conklin asked the council, hoping to avoid the angst in the department and in the families of the officers assigned to Yorba Linda over a possible termination. “I think we can find structural changes without having to cut services and be able to do this with less money.”
Councilmen Tom Lindsey and Jim Winder opposed giving Brea a notice of termination; Lindsey saying he wasn’t willing to throw all those years of good service “under the bus” when many of the council’s concerns and questions could be answered in a few months.
“You know as well as I know that this is not a termination of the contract; it is to put you on notice that hey, let’s get negotiating here and earn our business, we are a contract city,” Councilman John Anderson told Chief Conklin after voicing frustration with several aspects of the agreement.
Brea Police Department supporters whip out … a website!
A website, YorbaLindaPolice.com, has sprung into being to fight the (from its perspective) nefarious three-person council majority, which includes the frustrated Councilman Anderson. This website includes a 2-1/2 page, three-column list of people who have pledged as follows:
We support our local Yorba Linda Police and oppose any efforts by the Yorba Linda City Council to end our 42 year relationship with the Brea Police Department which has provided our community with excellent public safety.
The defenders of BPD’s continued contract with YL present the basic facts this way:
Yorba Linda residents will pay $179 per resident for Police Services by the Brea Police Department, based on the 2011-2012 fiscal year.
Should Yorba Linda pursue other police service options? It would appear that the option of a stand-alone Yorba Linda Police Department is too expensive compared to the service contract with Brea. Plus, the City has no facility, or the promise of one, from which to provide this service.
Service from the Orange County Sheriff’s Department is an excellent option, except service would likely be from their main facility in Santa Ana. The City of Placentia does not appear to be a good option from a financial perspective. The City of Anaheim would appear to be the best option outside of the City of Brea given its size and substantial resources and the proximity of one its substations to the City.
Generally, however, this report concludes that Yorba Linda probably would be best served by continuing its service with Brea.”
This is followed by many citizens saying nice things about the BPD.
The site presents a direct appeal to Yorba Lindans everywhere:
On November 1st, 2011, you and 2 members of your City Council were blindsided by a conceived plan to trigger the termination clause of the police services contract, and possibly replace the Brea Police Department, an agency that has served this community well for 42 years. What appeared to start as an “administrative report on potential future options for provision of law enforcement services” (Agenda Item 11), turned into a 3 to 2 vote to exercise the termination clause of our contract with the Brea Police Department.There was no opportunity for residents of Yorba Linda to express their opinions on the matter. However, provision was made to allow Orange County Sheriff-Coroner Sandra Hutchens to make a lengthy presentation for her organization to replace the BPD. She suggested, setting aside the several million dollars in up front costs to launch the relationship, that the OCSD might provide Yorba Linda with a substantial savings for law enforcement.We all wish it were that simple, but it’s clearly not.
This proposal did not include cost of vehicles, vehicle maintenence, motorcycles, computers, and a facility to house the officers. The central command for the Sheriff is located in Santa Ana. Residents are concerned about response times to violent crimes.
The site also contains a list of Yorba Linda Register articles that offer a lot of coverage and commentary. not all of which, admittedly, I read, but which I commend to you with relative enthusiasm.
It is in the comments section of the first Brea Register article, cited above, however, that caught my eye — not only because it seemed to drill down to the real nut of the issue, but because it reminded me of all that is fascinating (and daunting) about getting involved in local politics, where everything is personal.
A Register Top Commenter — which, interest duly declared, I am as well — named Ed Rakochy had this to say:
I noticed that Brea PD or Brea PD supporters have started their own Facebook page, which is attempting to scare the public in to thinking the City Council is eliminating Brea PD. This is the furthest thing from the truth. The Council had to give notice to terminate the contract in order to re-negotiate a new contract, because notice is a clause in the contract. This is about trying to get more control in the negotiating process and save taxpayers money and not dumping Brea PD. Stop with the scare tactics already.
This appears to be the forerunner of the website to which I link above. The self-proclaimed creator of the website, Jeff Johnson, says that the page is factual, that he is a Yorba Linda resident who just wants to inform the community, etc. The two continue to discuss things amicably.
Then, two days later, Top Commenter Jan Lavery Horton weighed in:
Mr [Rakochy] made the same statements at the Council meeting: stating the termination of the police contract was necessary to negotiate a new contract. He also stated here and at the Council meeting that the Council would not eliminate Brea PD. What I asked last night and I will ask again, how does he know this? How can he promise this? He is NOT on Council. He IS a staunch defender of Anderson and the majority Council. Possibly he is aware that this is another political ploy. I am sorry, but I for one am tired of games. I believe you negotiate in good faith. If the negotiations are not going well, then you seek to replace your service. But this was not the case with the Brea contract. At this point in time, staff felt they were making progress with their negotiations and I feel they should have been allowed to complete the task prior to the Councils actions.
Nine days later, her apparent co-position-holder Barbara Winnie moves in for the kill!
Bam! How ya like me now, Mr. Rakochy? We may never know, because he did not return to the comments section to reply to the comments left respectively more than one and two weeks after his.
So, quite apart from the merits of the Brea bid and the Sheriff’s bid, was Rakochy correct that the contract required notice of termination more than 18 months in advance of the end of the contract, in which event the notice given and seeking out competing bids was, well, pretty standard? Or by giving such notice was the Council misusing the termination clause, acting in “bad faith”, which “will hurt 2”? This seems to be the crux of the disagreement. Who’s right? It depends on the language of the contract, which at this point wild horses could probably not drag me off to read.
The interesting wrinkle!
I have to admit: despite KLND’s goading, I was not sure that I was going to write about this story at all. But this caught my attention:
The aforementined BPOA (Brea’s Police Union), which is lead by Triggerman Shawn Neel, the guy who gunned down the unarmed suspect last summer is leading an effort today calling residents and going door to door pusing the agenda. On the other side, the AOCSD is getting ready to launch an offensive (competing bid). This would be worthy of mention in an article.
Now this, as opposed to the relatively unremarkable prospect that a city wishing to renegotiate a service contract might convey the intention of possibly terminating said contract, seemed interesting! Not, I should say, because of the involvement of a police union (or two), which are rumored to like to have more jobs and therefore more members, but because of the description of Triggerman Shawn Neel, gunner-down (gun-downer?) of an unarmed suspect and now door-to-door agenda pusher.
There certainly did seem to be a story here — one of parental neglect! Seriously — if you name your kid “Triggerman,” what the hell do you expect of him? Of course he’s going to kill people.
Upon review of a state-of-the-art Google search (“Shawn Neel” and Brea), I found that his first name is apparently just “Shawn” — but they were still good reading. They tell you a bit about the various publications in our area.
For example, here’s a pretty straight story from OC Weekly:
The Orange County District Attorney’s office (OCDA) today released an 11-page letter based on its investigation of last year’s police shooting of the late Julian “Jules” Collender, but it is the final two paragraphs that say it all: “Based on all the evidence presented to and obtained by the OCDA, and based on the entirety of the facts contained in all the available reports we reviewed, and pursuant to the applicable legal precedents, it is our legal opinion that there is insufficient evidence to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Detective [Shawn] Neel committed a crime on June 30, 2010, when he shot Collender, causing his death.
“Accordingly, the OCDA is closing its inquiry into this incident.”
There’s a lot more great stuff there, including what seems like a pretty complete and objective timeline of events leading up to the shooting. It’s too much to summarize; click the link.
A later OC Weekly story announces the federal lawsuit brought by Collender’s family, which includes the following quote:
The death of Jules and treatment of his parents have drawn protests in front of Brea PD and in the chambers of the Yorba Linda City Council, which has even been urged to kill its contract with the police agency.
You can read more about Det. Neel at the site created to complain about Collender’s killing, Justice for Julian.
How about the comments section of Topix.com, from a writer using the presumable pseudonym of “Det Shawn Neel Brea PD”?
Detective Shawn Neel from the Brea Police Department – Come out and stop hiding-tell the truth – your man enough to pull a trigger of an assualt rifle with all your cop backup around you, but you know you are wrong and a murdering coward- why are you the only one that pulled the trigger? Where is the video? Stop hiding- you wanted to be a cop- man up and come out-coward- take responsibility for your cowardly actions- Julian is more of a man than you will ever be and you know that- you killed an unarmed man in cold blood – you are a criminal not a cop.
Well now! OK, then!
The Register has written about Detective Neel in his union leader capacity:
The pension rollbacks where not an “easy pill to swallow”, said Detective Shawn Neel, president of the Brea Police Association. But given the poor economy, the police union knew it had to accept a less-generous package than before, he added.
“We needed to do everything that we could to make sure nobody missed a mortgage payment because they were laid off,” Neel said. “It will sound corny, but if you can forgo a raise and allow somebody else to maintain employment – to me that is a no brainer.”
Layoffs were never part of negotiations, but Neel said if his bargaining unit didn’t accept a reduction, he figured some city employees would have lost their jobs.
Interesting — a union guy who was willing to negotiate — my pulse is not racing here, but perhaps someone else’s might. Let’s check out Friends for Fullerton’s Future!
tonyserra on June 29, 2011
I heard on KNX that the OCDA announced BREA PD detective (and UNION BOSS) Shawn Neel was aquitted for his MURDER of an unarmed young man EXACTLY a year ago.
Funny how the LACDA turns these investigations (OIS) in thirty days.
Even Funnier how Neels long time BEST FRIEND Billy HUTCHINS retired as chief three months ago.
Yikes. “UNION BOSS” and “MURDER of an unarmed young man”! FFFF does not FFFF around!
Just out of curiosity, I wonder if Orange Juice Blog itself has ever run anything on Neel? Well, the link turns up this Tony Bushala story linked to FFFF, about what is the easiest way to get OC’s DA to whitewash an investigation (in this case the sexual misconduct one against Officer Al Rincon), but that doesn’t seem to mention Neel … wait, there it is, down in the sole comment:
The easiset way is to join the local POA, those union guys get a way with murder! Literally!
Just ask Brea PD Detective Shawn Neel, who murdered Jullian collender in Yorba Linda. He used his POA connections to thwart the investigation.
Unions! Murder! Who wrote this comment, anyway?
kenlaysnotdead Posted September 13, 2011 at 4:48 PM
What you can do!
If you’re interested in this story — by which I mean the substantive issue of with whom Yorba Linda should contract for its police services rather than how I came to write this story — you can attend the Yorba Linda City Council meeting on Tuesday, January 3, 2012 at 6:30PM, which as this is published is just less than 24 hours away and make your opinion known. Or you can watch events, take notes … even write a follow up story about what’s going on! (Offer possibly not open to anyone with, um, “personal conflicts.”) You can publish it here! We’ll credit you! Because this is pretty much the last time I plan to discuss it unless something more interesting happens, so I suggest reading both the Register and the Pro-Brea PD site after that for more.
Now don’t anyone say that I’ve never written anything about Brea and Yorba Linda — or that I don’t know how to investigate a little when I want to.
Man, that was just about the most incomprehensible thing I’ve ever tried to read.
Brea is in over it’s head. It has just 75% of the population of YL and is providing cop services? That makes no sense unless you happen to be one of the Brea cops. Or one of Brea’s accountants who by know has figured out Brea is on the hook for YL’s portion of the unfunded cop pension liability!!
YL can get a bigger, better deal from OCSD and wriggle out from its pension obligation!
Yay! 3 @ 50!
Art wants me to cover local news and Ken wanted me to cover this. Think of it as performance art. I was bored as hell by it to until I got to the punch line of why KLND was apparently pushing the story. I believe that I should not be absolved from covering local news.
Forgot to mention: your comment doesn’t make sense. What has the size of a city to do with its ability to provide cop services? And if Brea is worried about being on the hook, why does it want to continue the contract?
Interesting to know that you favor outsourcing to larger civil units, though!
The size of the city has lots to do with it. Brea can’t afford to absorb either the extra cops or their unfunded pension liability. That’s real simple. YL could contract with OCSD and jump the hook. Getting rid of Brea PDs overhead would save them money.
Meanwhile beads of blood-sweat must be running down the face of Chiefie and the Brea City Council who would lose 60% of their force and could no longer hide the unfunded pension liability over long-term actuarial time frames. The people of Brea are screwed either way.
Since I don’t live in YL I don’t care what they do. Just reportin’ the facts.
I presume that if Brea lost the Yorba Linda “account” it would lead to police layoffs. Is someone arguing that it could absorb the extra cops? Not me!
As for unfunded pension liability, presumably the cops who would be laid off — and, most likely, hired by the Sheriff’s Department, given their expertise — would be those with the least seniority, therefore the least vested in the pension system. So Brea would end up with an older police force and YL a younger one. Not ideal, but not earth-shattering either.
If you think that you can make a case that “Brea is screwed either way” that will stand up to scrutiny, by all means let’s see it, including the numbers. It would need to be fleshed out compared to the above, but would make an interesting post.
Where on earth do you get your facts? You couldn’t possibly believe what you just wrote… could you? Brea has done a better job than most OC cities dealing with pension issues and wouldn’t lose anywhere near that 60% figure you suggested.
Since you live in neither city, and don’t care what they do, what’s your motivation for weighing in here in the first place?
Tony is very interested in public pension issues. Refer to the Friends for Fullerton’s Future RSS feed on the front page.
As a Brea resident, I’m interested in how we’ve done a better job with pension issues. Can you explain?
As they say in Jr. High School (or fourteen year old worlds):
“Made you look”.
+1
Greg,
Good grief. Tony had more to say in his brief comment than you did in this entire ridiculous post.
When it comes to blogging, being brief – and getting to the point quickly, is a good thing.
Are you saying that there was no interesting story there and that KLND led me there for some ulterior reason?
Strangely, That’s not to say it wa deliberate, likely a mistake on my part, I wrote:
“Diamond, it was rumored that your were a GOP plant, tasked with killing us: WITH BOREDOM………………”
The post was in reply to his Obama NDAA post, but, as Pedroza said……..Shorter is better.
Here Greg, try this instead: http://ocpoliticsblog.com/2012/01/02/yorba-linda-council-wisely-exploring-options-as-police-costs-have-soared/
SHUT UP! SHUT UP! YOU DON’T EVEN LIVE IN YORBA LINDA!!!
(hahahahaha)
Seriously, though, this is sort of stupid:
So the fact that it can respond passably well to a place where hardly anyone lives shows that it can serve a city of over 60,000 from that far away? OK!
As I say in the post, for YL to seek competitive bids to drive down the price is normal operation and I have no problem with it. By all means, YL, why not get the biggest bargain?
In other words: if something has been working effectively to lower crime, then there’s no reason not to change it. Brilliant! And the sentiment in the sentence I put in bold — I can only hope that all insights from the OCPolitics Blog will be this incisive! Santa Ana blogging at its best!
I believe YL could be served by the Corona PD or even the Riverside SD. Probably not politically popular, but an option?
Anaheim would make quite a bit of sense – more than Brea since Anaheim Hills/Canyon area is contiguous with the entire YL southern boundary.
The cops respond from a central command center. They would only need a place to change clothes and park their vehicles – like a cheap rent industrial building with some parking.
Yes, and Brea is contiguous with the whole western boundary (which, I believe, is more densely populated) of YL. So why does the contiguity of the least populated section of Anaheim — which, um, has its own policing problems, if you know what I mean — made more sense than Brea?
But, hey, if the idea is that more bids lowers the price — a tried and true method of doing so — then by all means more bids YL should seek! Chino Hills has a police department; maybe it should bid too. Closer than Riverside!
Of course, if crime statistics go up or quality of service goes down, the public is gonna be pissed…. I’m sure that’s in your equation somewhere.
That’s incorrect. Brea is contiguous with a portion of the northern YL city limit which is mostly open space and State park (please consult a map). The only way to get to YL from Brea is to pass through a corner of Placentia on Imperial or Rose.
BTW, the whole of south County is patrolled by OCSD. One of the safest places in the State.
I’ve checked, and you’re right — there is a small corner of Placentia in between Brea and YL on Imperial, south of the actual contiguous portion. Are there even signs for Placentia up there? The transition seems seamless to me. So: not contiguous by major highway, merely close and convenient and apparently effective.
I don’t think that South County is one of the safest places in the state if you’re Latino, but if that proves to you that OCSD is superior to BPD, so be it.
By the way: does lousier pensions lead to better cops who are more likely to avoid Kelly Thomas killing-type egregious misbehavior?
I don’t know. I do know that gold-plated pensions didn’t prevent it.
Having an attention span of only about 2 minutes, I had to skim this lengthy post. What I got out of it is (1) the DA investigated a shooting by a detective and concluded a crime was committed, but apparently there is no prosecution – If I have that right, shouldn’t that be a headline grabber?, and (2) two unions are battling for representation of Yorba Linda law enforcers.
Not exactly.
(1) The DA apparently concluded that there was not sufficient evidence of a crime to prosecute, but that is old news.
(2) It’s not so much two unions as two law enforcement departments (the officers of each of which are represented by unions): Brea Police and County Sheriffs.
I can’t blame you for skimming it, but it is what the customer ordered.
I find it amusing those who do not live in the City have so much to say about this process. Have to wonder why this is so interesting to you- must be a slow blog info day.
What you fail to mention is:
1. Although Sheriffs cover the incorporated portions of the City, their response time is abysmal and is supplemented by Brea PD
2. The fact that the City should negotiate for a better deal in this economy is without dispute. The problem was it came out of no where. For a Council that consistently espouses transparency it was a joke. And to have the Sheriff ready and able to provide a proposal at the Council meeting about how they could cut costs for Yorba Linda is more than a bit suspicious since one of our Council members is a Asst DA.
3. The City staff has stated at the meeting, they were making headway in reducing costs. Asked for more time to negotiate and resolve the Councils concerns. But instead, the three majority members pulled the trigger and now try to white-wash it by lying to the public stating Brea PD was not given a termination notice.
4. The DA Council member has taken substantial campaign donations from the OC Sheriff union and its members.
5. Word has it he has been promised substantial support when he runs for judgeship if he delivers Yorba Linda to the Sheriffs
5. there is no guarantee that Brea PD officers would be picked up by the OC Sheriff. Highly unlikely since Sheriffs have to do “jail duty” before hitting the streets.
The Collendar shooting was unfortunate. But do you really believe any officer would just go up to a person and shoot them? There is more to this than we know and its not that I believe police officers can’t do bad things. Just look at the Fullerton PD killing. But I do believe the investigation must have shown something was amiss when they did not file charges.
IMHO
Haha, now you sound like Art Pedroza, the Santa Ana blogger who insists that nobody outside Santa Ana can write about Santa Ana – but has just started a new OC politics blog, just so he can write about this whole Brea / Yorba Linda thing.
You should probably be complaining more on Art’s blog though. Because the author of this post is a Brea resident and this affects him.
Still, thank you for the new information and the Yorba Linda view.
Thanks for the inside perspective. It was a little bit of a slow blog day, yes, but I wrote it because keylaysnotdead kept pestering me to. Given that the City Council meeting presented in the opposition website was tonight, and that I knew I’d be out for most of last evening, I had to write it really quickly. I didn’t mind it being boring because the cattish infighting and such gave a pretty accurate representation of what local politics is like and I thought that it was in some ways more interesting not to dress it up. Local politics is a grind; this is exhibit 1.
Then I got to the end, saw the final comment, and realized that my “muse” may have had the ulterior motive of getting me to unwittingly go after a public employee union representative — a larger crime, in some minds, than mere murder — and I snapped. I’m happy to provide an opportunity, though, for you to present the material you do above — if you’re able to document any of it with citations, please do — and I hope that informed people with the opposite position will feel welcome to do the same.
Interest declared: I am from Brea, but I think that Yorba Linda should do what’s best for Yorba Linda. If it’s sticking with Brea P.D., so much the better.
“If it’s sticking with Brea P.D., so much the better.”
Good thinking. Or else your town will have 60 cops to get rid of and be on the hook for their unfunded pension liability.
Keep cheerleading for that!
Did that strike you as “cheerleading,” Tony? I said that Yorba Linda should do what best suits is interests, even if it is at Brea’s expense. If you want to see cheerleading — for the opposite result — go see Art’s “well-reasoned commentary” on the matter. (Shouldn’t I be able to expect better of you than this?)
YL Resident,
Welcome to the Circus!
One thing about OJB, all views (no matter how crazy) are welcome (Stan notwithstanding).
There is a lot we don’t know about Jullians death. I first became aware of this when I met his sister, who helped lead the questioning of the “cover-up”. I don’t think Neel went out and looked for a kid to shoot in the back, I think he was poorly trained, under practiced and panicked. he then used his position as BPOA President to cover up what would otherwise be described as a murder. READ THE REPORTS. It for whatever reason, did not achieve the attention that Kelley Thomas did, maybe if someone like Bushla lived in Yorba Linda it might have.
It’s all too cozy for me and perhaps uncomfortable for others close to labor to question. He was after all “just a bad kid”???????WTF
The law firm representing the parents is the one to which Erwin Chemerinsky is an outside counsel. I think that this is not going to be swept under any rug.
“Although Sheriffs cover the incorporated portions of the City, their response time is abysmal and is supplemented by Brea PD”
I think you meant to say “unincorporated portions of the City” which of course would be an oxymoron. The OCSD has LE responsibility in those small islands, and of course Brea PD is first responder because the citizens of YL, not the County are paying for it. The closest OCSD substation is in Villa Park and their presence in the islands of North OC is necessarily sketchy. None of which has anything to do with their response times where they have a contractual presence.
You’re tipping your hand, friend.
“Kenlaysnotdead kept pestering me…….”
That’s laying it down a bit thick……But, I achieved my goal of having you write something outside the realm.
Next on my hit list is “Goading” (which by definition is a rod used to move a large animal) Vern into taking on the exorbitant late fee’s charged by the HB library as a tax on the poor and internetless masses. This has caused undue harm to hundreds of disaffected soles, while folks like you order from Amazon and Barnes and Noble further destructing Mother Earth with UPS created polution.
Vern, If you really, really cared about the 99%, you would camp out in front of the Ellis Street library (is there one?), and insist they put a stop to this madness.
Oh and Larry Gilbert, your next!
Lighten’ up Diamond.
It’s called the Huntington Central Library, and is pretty close to Ellis and Goldenwest. That’s where I do my concerts, most months. When are you gonna come to one?
Dude, you tried to get me to write a story about something fairly pedestrian because, so far as I can tell, one of the people involved is someone you accuse of murder, and a union rep to boot. Tell me to “lighten up” when you haven’t pulled that sort of stunt. I am now a large animal who will not be moved by your rod.
I am, however, sorry about your late fees. Turn the books in on time next time.
Tell me to “lighten up” when you haven’t pulled that sort of stunt. I am now a large animal who will not be moved by your rod.
Not even a lightening rod? Dang.
Goad am it!
My first mistake, reading this thing word for word. Second mistake, thinking I might run across someone who actually understands both the scope and actual facts behind the central issues being bantered about.
YL’s move to cease negotiations with Brea by terminating the contract and moving to a competitive bid process has an easily contested launch on Nov. 1 and seems to have produced no end to double talking from a variety of groups, none the least of which is the acknowledged voting block on the YL council and the YLRRR who put them there.
Once the City of Brea published the facts behind the allegations being made, the angry emails and full page ads dried right up. The were amateurish anyway and it’s tough to sell the idea that the sky is falling once people understand that it isn’t.
Resurrecting the whole tragic Collender matter and attempting to suggest it has anything to do with YL seeking the most intelligent and affordable solution to providing law enforcement is sadly disgusting. Anyone with half a heart will feel deep sympathy for the Collender family, but the incident has no logical connection to the law enforcement services issue.
The 06/29/11 OCDA report, copies of which seem to be circulating all over town, made a thorough investigation into all aspects of the incident (with detailed account of the video) and found insufficient evidence to prove any crime had been committed. Yes, I have a copy. Yes, I have read it carefully.
The repetitive “in crowd” babbling and self aggrandizing commentary following what I agree will prove to be the most boring OCJ story of 2012, is a complete waste of time. There is zero value added to the discussion.
Here’s ten minutes of my life I’ll never get back.
Welcome, Rick.
Well, you can’t say that you weren’t warned about it being boring.
This story started as a sort of a lark, because I was (as noted above) being goaded into writing about it by one of our participants. It seemed to me that it was a standard sort of contract negotiation bump in the road, and no one could really argue that YL was not justified in seeking a better contract (if it chose) and to do so by seeking alternative bids (if it chose.) Whether it jumped out of the process too early or not, and why, is the stuff of which squabbles at the city government level are made.
I started writing about it, then, as an example of how painful it can be (on all sides) to be part of local government, as well as a sort of interesting story on how governmental units (city and county) compete for such service agreements. It was sort of a slice-of-civic-life story.
As I was getting deeper into the story, however, I discovered that there was an undercurrent that seemed to be driving some of the rancor (and arguably also driving the very prodding for me to write about it): the Collender tragedy. The actual target seemed to be the police detective who had shot Collender — and it was being brought up here because he was the leader of the union that at least some of those favoring the change want to rebuff.
So, I agree, resurrecting the Collender matter is sadly disgusting; I do so only because it appears to be the motivation for a campaign against Det. Neel (and thus the Brea P.D.) — one that may be motivated both because of the asserted merits of the matter and because he is disliked because he is a labor leader (or, as one of the comments had it, “boss.”) This doesn’t mean that any particular person or group has that sort of ad hominem attack as its reason for raising the issue — you apparently don’t, for example — but it is part of the equation.
There may well be sufficient reason for YL to want change without it, but for some at least there is some motive to use the fact that Neel was investigated for shooting an unarmed man as a reason for rejecting the Brea P.D. It seems, in fact, that Neel is being used to wrestle this story to become one about greedy and powerful public unions, on whom the too-high (from YL’s perspective) cost of the contract can be blamed.
This now becomes a potentially much darker story, one in which the fact of one man’s participation in a public union becomes a basis for punishing him, and his union, for simply being part of the union movement. That does not seem to be your motivation; it does seem to me to be part of what sent me onto the trail of this story. That I find interesting and sad — but it is also, if my interpretation is right — an example of how municipal politics works in Orange County right now: bad things may happen to people that wouldn’t happen to them otherwise because they have become active in unions.
I think that the case I made here is merely suggestive, but one still bearing note. My question for you is: why was I turned on to writing about this (frankly pretty boring) story? What and whose purpose did it serve? Was it about what it seemed to be about — or, at a deeper level, was it about something else as well or instead? I don’t know the answers; all I can do is tell you what I found — and, from you and others, provide more informed people a chance to weigh in with their perspectives. To me, that makes what initially did seem to be a story boring enough for me to make fun of it myself a little less boring.
I appreciate the candid and civil response.
The Collender matter has no business in this business. Neel served a one year term as President of BPOA and a new president has just assumed the duties, whatever they may be, for 2012. Singling out Neel or the BPOA in this manner as “part of the equation” makes no sense at all.
Some people want to take a broader look at their options rather than continuing negotiations with Brea… the city, not the union. Remember, BPOA plays no role in the process whatsoever and has been noticeably silent in this process.
Let me say that again. The “union” plays no role in the process whatsoever. Using Neel’s principally figurehead role with a nonparticipating organization as the crux of the argument doesn’t hold up under closer scrutiny.
I believe that Brea’s City Manager, Director of Finance, the Chief of Police and maybe even members of Brea’s Command Staff (not members of BPOA by the way) negotiate the contract and will be the group that responds to the RFP.
So what is the real story here?
Municipalities (counties and states) have felt as though their hands have been tied in their negotiations with public employee unions for many years, especially those working in public safety. At all levels of government they are all using using the current economic condition and growing public antiunion sentiment to turn the tables in their favor and to help reduce the ballooning cost of government.
So, on the grand scale of things (as you seems to imply) this is predominantly a financially motivated cost cutting effort. Finding a more economical solution to meet YL’s law enforcement needs is merely one battle in the much larger war.
If you’ll look up way at the top of the story, you’ll see the three comments posted in a New Santa Ana thread that sought my attention. The third of these said:
This was from someone who, if I catch his drift correctly, is on your side of this argument (as is Tony Bushala). That doesn’t mean that I can impute this same motivation and tactic to you and others, and I don’t.
So that’s how Neel (and Collender) became part of the story. What I didn’t know until the very end of my writing was that the same person had previously published this comment to a Tony Bushala story in this very blog asking (rhetorically, I presume) about “what is the easiest way to get OC’s DA to whitewash an investigation”:
So, there you have it. To you, it’s a story about local politics and choices that should not be part of anything broader. To others, it seems to be part of a broader struggle that conveniently can make use of an otherwise pedestrian bit of local politics.
I think that that says something about Orange County that isn’t actually entirely boring.
You know how some stories get a life of their own? Unfortunately, this doesn’t seem to be one of them.
Rick,
I think it sucks that Neel abuses his position as President of the FPOA the shill for the cities bid.
I guess I shouldn’t care, but I am frightened by the trend, and this (article) came about because I was watching football at a friens house in YL and BPOA members called and the conversations began.
The irony of the “REPUBLICAN” bastion of OC, Dick Nixon’s boyhood home is willing to let WASTEFUL GOVERNMENT SPENDING take place, when cheaper alternatives exist is pretty funny.
And by the way, the fact that Neel pulled the trigger on the kid, has WAY less to do with this article than the fact that as BPOA President he and the chief were offered a wide lattitude in the investigation. Again, If there had been a Tony Bushala in Yorba Linda, or even a Blogger COUNTYWIDE willing to take on this, things might be different (disclaimer: I am passionate about this; the victims sister explainedto me in plain ENGLISH the events). Additioanlly, While the OCW reported it, blogs like this one and gabrieal san ramon “were meaning to right about it”.
No problem for me. I am glad greg decided to write something, hopefully it will have an impact on the discussion.
Well KLND, everyone’s entitled to their opinions. You’ve provided little or nothing to convince me there is substance or fact behind your allegations, particularly in the Neel matter, which has nothing to do with how the department as a whole has provided good service for over four decades.
The good news is that you’re using your head and making every effort to form a considered opinion. The fact that we disagree is irrelevant. I wish a lot more “citizens” would wake up and do the same.
The BPOA having nothing to do with the issue?????
A) Most Naive thing ever posted here.
OR
B) Worst Shilling EVER here (that makes you the king given the history)