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	<title>Comments on: June 6 marks the 30th anniversary of Prop 13, the biggest tax revolt in CA history</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2008/06/june-6-marks-the-30th-anniversary-of-prop-13-the-biggest-tax-revolt-in-ca-history/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2008/06/june-6-marks-the-30th-anniversary-of-prop-13-the-biggest-tax-revolt-in-ca-history/?utm_source=rss&#038;utm_medium=rss&#038;utm_campaign=june-6-marks-the-30th-anniversary-of-prop-13-the-biggest-tax-revolt-in-ca-history</link>
	<description>Orange County&#039;s top political blog</description>
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		<title>By: Larry Gilbert</title>
		<link>http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2008/06/june-6-marks-the-30th-anniversary-of-prop-13-the-biggest-tax-revolt-in-ca-history/comment-page-1/#comment-58489</link>
		<dc:creator>Larry Gilbert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Jun 2008 23:32:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orangejuiceblog.com/?p=6885#comment-58489</guid>
		<description>public school suffer.
When Prop 13 was passed we enjoyed a huge surplus in our state. &quot;In January 1977, the estimated surplus for fiscal year 1977-78 was $940 million, representing about 7.5 percent of revenues. Eighteen months later, by June, 1978, the cumulative surplus was about $5.9 billion—an increase of $5 billion (with the 1977-78 surplus being estimated at about $3.7 billion.&quot; 

Let me suggest that you do some research as to why voters felt Prop 13 was the right direction for the electorate to take in their 1978 vote of approval.

How many times do we need to repeat ourselves?
Let&#039;s shift gears. Let&#039;s just suppose you have a job and your net is x dollars per week or month or whatever. Do you spend more than your net income? If so, how do you accomplish this magic anyway? Do you max out your credit cards hoping that tomorrow will take of itself?
Knowing that the economy is in a tailspin do you expand the size of government and create more entitlements without a responsible plan as to how you will fund these new programs?
That appears to be what&#039;s happening in Sacramento.
Lets just float some more Bonds and let future generations deal with the consequences. You know, monthly principle and interest payments.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>public school suffer.<br />
When Prop 13 was passed we enjoyed a huge surplus in our state. &#8220;In January 1977, the estimated surplus for fiscal year 1977-78 was $940 million, representing about 7.5 percent of revenues. Eighteen months later, by June, 1978, the cumulative surplus was about $5.9 billion—an increase of $5 billion (with the 1977-78 surplus being estimated at about $3.7 billion.&#8221; </p>
<p>Let me suggest that you do some research as to why voters felt Prop 13 was the right direction for the electorate to take in their 1978 vote of approval.</p>
<p>How many times do we need to repeat ourselves?<br />
Let&#8217;s shift gears. Let&#8217;s just suppose you have a job and your net is x dollars per week or month or whatever. Do you spend more than your net income? If so, how do you accomplish this magic anyway? Do you max out your credit cards hoping that tomorrow will take of itself?<br />
Knowing that the economy is in a tailspin do you expand the size of government and create more entitlements without a responsible plan as to how you will fund these new programs?<br />
That appears to be what&#8217;s happening in Sacramento.<br />
Lets just float some more Bonds and let future generations deal with the consequences. You know, monthly principle and interest payments.</p>
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		<title>By: Public Schools Suffer</title>
		<link>http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2008/06/june-6-marks-the-30th-anniversary-of-prop-13-the-biggest-tax-revolt-in-ca-history/comment-page-1/#comment-58301</link>
		<dc:creator>Public Schools Suffer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Jun 2008 05:31:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orangejuiceblog.com/?p=6885#comment-58301</guid>
		<description>Yes, because as we face a budget crisis we need to stop and recognize a tax cut enacted thirty years ago.  That makes tons of sense.  How awful of Democrats.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, because as we face a budget crisis we need to stop and recognize a tax cut enacted thirty years ago.  That makes tons of sense.  How awful of Democrats.</p>
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		<title>By: Larry Gilbert</title>
		<link>http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2008/06/june-6-marks-the-30th-anniversary-of-prop-13-the-biggest-tax-revolt-in-ca-history/comment-page-1/#comment-58227</link>
		<dc:creator>Larry Gilbert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 20:33:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orangejuiceblog.com/?p=6885#comment-58227</guid>
		<description>From today&#039;s Sac Bee.
Assemblyman Bob Huff, R-Diamond Bar, (who is headed to the state Senate), blasted the Assembly Democratic leadership for refusing to schedule a hearing for his non-binding resolution to honor Proposition 13 turning 30.

&quot;It has become crystal clear that Democrats in Sacramento do not wish to recognize the benefits and the legacy of a policy that has not only lifted an unbearable tax burden off the backs of so many Californians,&quot; Huff said in a statement.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From today&#8217;s Sac Bee.<br />
Assemblyman Bob Huff, R-Diamond Bar, (who is headed to the state Senate), blasted the Assembly Democratic leadership for refusing to schedule a hearing for his non-binding resolution to honor Proposition 13 turning 30.</p>
<p>&#8220;It has become crystal clear that Democrats in Sacramento do not wish to recognize the benefits and the legacy of a policy that has not only lifted an unbearable tax burden off the backs of so many Californians,&#8221; Huff said in a statement.</p>
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		<title>By: Public Schools Suffer</title>
		<link>http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2008/06/june-6-marks-the-30th-anniversary-of-prop-13-the-biggest-tax-revolt-in-ca-history/comment-page-1/#comment-58204</link>
		<dc:creator>Public Schools Suffer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 16:02:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orangejuiceblog.com/?p=6885#comment-58204</guid>
		<description>Yes, because low taxes is helping everyone keep their houses now.  It&#039;s ot the whole issue, it&#039;s just one piece of the puzzle.

Teachers are allowed to protest, that is what it&#039;s about.  Anyone who questions the dedication of teachers must not know any.  They have adavanced degrees, they don&#039;t get paid like professionals and they spend their own money for supplies in the classroom.  But the refusal by both sides to budge on fixing the problem because of such wedge issues like immigration, vouchers and unions only insures that the kids in the classroom or shortchanged.  Why can&#039;t everyone put aside their dogma for a second and actually think of a way to solve the issue?

&quot;Since you like to put up images of an ass, bite me!&quot;  - Huh?  I don&#039;t know what this is about.  I&#039;m trying to have a civil discussion about taxes and spending.  I believe Republicans fail to realize that people demand services but don&#039;t want to have to pay for them.  And I also believe that we do spend too much, so I&#039;m not arguing that.  

Republicans like to complain about taxes and spending but offer no solutions on how to insure that Government provides the services expected.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, because low taxes is helping everyone keep their houses now.  It&#8217;s ot the whole issue, it&#8217;s just one piece of the puzzle.</p>
<p>Teachers are allowed to protest, that is what it&#8217;s about.  Anyone who questions the dedication of teachers must not know any.  They have adavanced degrees, they don&#8217;t get paid like professionals and they spend their own money for supplies in the classroom.  But the refusal by both sides to budge on fixing the problem because of such wedge issues like immigration, vouchers and unions only insures that the kids in the classroom or shortchanged.  Why can&#8217;t everyone put aside their dogma for a second and actually think of a way to solve the issue?</p>
<p>&#8220;Since you like to put up images of an ass, bite me!&#8221;  &#8211; Huh?  I don&#8217;t know what this is about.  I&#8217;m trying to have a civil discussion about taxes and spending.  I believe Republicans fail to realize that people demand services but don&#8217;t want to have to pay for them.  And I also believe that we do spend too much, so I&#8217;m not arguing that.  </p>
<p>Republicans like to complain about taxes and spending but offer no solutions on how to insure that Government provides the services expected.</p>
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		<title>By: Carl Overmyer</title>
		<link>http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2008/06/june-6-marks-the-30th-anniversary-of-prop-13-the-biggest-tax-revolt-in-ca-history/comment-page-1/#comment-58191</link>
		<dc:creator>Carl Overmyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 13:39:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orangejuiceblog.com/?p=6885#comment-58191</guid>
		<description>PSS,

If you would like to explain to us how the late in at LA schools today is representative of teachers making better schools, or is it simply another union action? Looks to me like they are just interested in the employment prospects not in their professional obligation to actualy teach. I believe this is a greater contributing factor to the decline of our public schools than anything else.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>PSS,</p>
<p>If you would like to explain to us how the late in at LA schools today is representative of teachers making better schools, or is it simply another union action? Looks to me like they are just interested in the employment prospects not in their professional obligation to actualy teach. I believe this is a greater contributing factor to the decline of our public schools than anything else.</p>
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		<title>By: Anony</title>
		<link>http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2008/06/june-6-marks-the-30th-anniversary-of-prop-13-the-biggest-tax-revolt-in-ca-history/comment-page-1/#comment-58189</link>
		<dc:creator>Anony</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 13:37:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orangejuiceblog.com/?p=6885#comment-58189</guid>
		<description>Larry:

Prop13 assured most citizens in California could retain their property.  Without it quite honestly  we would all be renters or homeless.  

While Sarah Michelle Spinosa mocks you, how can you take a &quot;child&quot; serious???  Has she always been a ward of the state???

She is just the folks Prop. 13 stopped from fleecing us.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Larry:</p>
<p>Prop13 assured most citizens in California could retain their property.  Without it quite honestly  we would all be renters or homeless.  </p>
<p>While Sarah Michelle Spinosa mocks you, how can you take a &#8220;child&#8221; serious???  Has she always been a ward of the state???</p>
<p>She is just the folks Prop. 13 stopped from fleecing us.</p>
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		<title>By: Anony</title>
		<link>http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2008/06/june-6-marks-the-30th-anniversary-of-prop-13-the-biggest-tax-revolt-in-ca-history/comment-page-1/#comment-58170</link>
		<dc:creator>Anony</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 06:05:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orangejuiceblog.com/?p=6885#comment-58170</guid>
		<description>Public Schools Suffer,

Been there SEEN THAT. Jarvis put a lid on property taxes and some creative bastard figured out that by using prop measures and bonds they could circumvent the whole idea. THEN they discovered no one was really watching what they did with that money and viola, A Gold card for schoool and city administrations! Since you like to put up images of an ass, bite me!

Go back and see where the schools were 20 years ago compared to today. As Larry Gibert pointed out we have a SPENDING problem, more correctly named malfeasance in office.

Howard Jarvis intended for monies taken to be accounted for and put to accountable use.

You can take Clinton for whatever you think. He just tanked his old ladies chances for president because his ego is as crooked as his D**k.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Public Schools Suffer,</p>
<p>Been there SEEN THAT. Jarvis put a lid on property taxes and some creative bastard figured out that by using prop measures and bonds they could circumvent the whole idea. THEN they discovered no one was really watching what they did with that money and viola, A Gold card for schoool and city administrations! Since you like to put up images of an ass, bite me!</p>
<p>Go back and see where the schools were 20 years ago compared to today. As Larry Gibert pointed out we have a SPENDING problem, more correctly named malfeasance in office.</p>
<p>Howard Jarvis intended for monies taken to be accounted for and put to accountable use.</p>
<p>You can take Clinton for whatever you think. He just tanked his old ladies chances for president because his ego is as crooked as his D**k.</p>
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		<title>By: Carl Overmyer</title>
		<link>http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2008/06/june-6-marks-the-30th-anniversary-of-prop-13-the-biggest-tax-revolt-in-ca-history/comment-page-1/#comment-58169</link>
		<dc:creator>Carl Overmyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 05:46:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orangejuiceblog.com/?p=6885#comment-58169</guid>
		<description>Public Schools Suffer, 
As you may or may not have been taught in school, it is the legislative bodies that spend and direct those expenditures of our tax dollars, not the executive branch. As well, the subject of Larry&#039;s post was about the state spending and limitations, not federal, but the same expenditure rules still apply. So bash away at the R&#039;s all you want, last time I looked it was the other party that controlled both the state and federal legislatures now. Just a note of clarity, I think it was the R&#039;s that controlled the federal legislature for most of the time Mr. Clinton was in office. I can&#039;t remember the last time that the R&#039;s had more than 41 votes in Sacramento.

Prop 13 didn&#039;t kill public education, poor management and unions have been sucking it dry for a prolonged period of time. It simply refuses to die because ill-informed voters keep voting for irresponsible bond measures that inject funds back into the system and give them more time and money to cover up their mistakes.

I am proud to have been a part of the taxpayer revolt in my younger years and I&#039;m very glad that we did at least slow them down from spending any more than they still do. One can only wonder what kind of irresponsible spending would have ensued had we not poured water on their coals back then. 

Yes Larry, I remember Mr. Gann as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Public Schools Suffer,<br />
As you may or may not have been taught in school, it is the legislative bodies that spend and direct those expenditures of our tax dollars, not the executive branch. As well, the subject of Larry&#8217;s post was about the state spending and limitations, not federal, but the same expenditure rules still apply. So bash away at the R&#8217;s all you want, last time I looked it was the other party that controlled both the state and federal legislatures now. Just a note of clarity, I think it was the R&#8217;s that controlled the federal legislature for most of the time Mr. Clinton was in office. I can&#8217;t remember the last time that the R&#8217;s had more than 41 votes in Sacramento.</p>
<p>Prop 13 didn&#8217;t kill public education, poor management and unions have been sucking it dry for a prolonged period of time. It simply refuses to die because ill-informed voters keep voting for irresponsible bond measures that inject funds back into the system and give them more time and money to cover up their mistakes.</p>
<p>I am proud to have been a part of the taxpayer revolt in my younger years and I&#8217;m very glad that we did at least slow them down from spending any more than they still do. One can only wonder what kind of irresponsible spending would have ensued had we not poured water on their coals back then. </p>
<p>Yes Larry, I remember Mr. Gann as well.</p>
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		<title>By: Public Schools Suffer</title>
		<link>http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2008/06/june-6-marks-the-30th-anniversary-of-prop-13-the-biggest-tax-revolt-in-ca-history/comment-page-1/#comment-58160</link>
		<dc:creator>Public Schools Suffer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 04:41:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orangejuiceblog.com/?p=6885#comment-58160</guid>
		<description>I never said anything about drop out rates having anything to do with Jarvis, Andy brought that up.  Did you not read my comment? 

&quot;The issue has to do with funding going to the wrong priorities and not having the bulk of our money going to the classroom.&quot;

I made the same point you are making.  There is too much money on top, Administrators should be minimal and teaching should be the most important part of EDUCATION.

It&#039;s called fiscal responsibility.  Education is one of those things that shouldn&#039;t be shortchanged and I made the point that we need to be sure we are spending the money in the right place, I said nothing about spending MORE money but you can&#039;t move away from your talking points.

There is a funding and a spending problem and when Republicans and Democrats can agree that both need a good long hard look then we can talk.  Seriously, the finger pointing does nothing and it moves us nowhere.

I&#039;m so tired of Republicans blaming taxes for all our woes and spending out of control when they have a President who has spent more money than any other President in the history of this Country.  When the Democratic President left office we had a surplus, we no longer do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I never said anything about drop out rates having anything to do with Jarvis, Andy brought that up.  Did you not read my comment? </p>
<p>&#8220;The issue has to do with funding going to the wrong priorities and not having the bulk of our money going to the classroom.&#8221;</p>
<p>I made the same point you are making.  There is too much money on top, Administrators should be minimal and teaching should be the most important part of EDUCATION.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s called fiscal responsibility.  Education is one of those things that shouldn&#8217;t be shortchanged and I made the point that we need to be sure we are spending the money in the right place, I said nothing about spending MORE money but you can&#8217;t move away from your talking points.</p>
<p>There is a funding and a spending problem and when Republicans and Democrats can agree that both need a good long hard look then we can talk.  Seriously, the finger pointing does nothing and it moves us nowhere.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m so tired of Republicans blaming taxes for all our woes and spending out of control when they have a President who has spent more money than any other President in the history of this Country.  When the Democratic President left office we had a surplus, we no longer do.</p>
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		<title>By: Larry Gilbert</title>
		<link>http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2008/06/june-6-marks-the-30th-anniversary-of-prop-13-the-biggest-tax-revolt-in-ca-history/comment-page-1/#comment-58159</link>
		<dc:creator>Larry Gilbert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 04:26:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orangejuiceblog.com/?p=6885#comment-58159</guid>
		<description>Public school suffer.

Perhaps you need to check our state&#039;s cash register. We do NOT have a revenue problem. We have a SPENDING problem. Big government, supported by the Democratic majority, comes at a very painful price. And as we continue to float Bonds to balalnce our budget who do you think will be paying them off? Not me; but my grandkids and yours. Does that make you feel better?

Throwing more money at education is not the answer. Perhaps you might question how much of the money actually finds it way down to the teachers. How much are we paying Superintendent&#039;s of Education all over this state anyway?

Are you saying that 50 percent of Latino&#039;s in LAUSD are dropping out of school because of Howard Jarvis?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Public school suffer.</p>
<p>Perhaps you need to check our state&#8217;s cash register. We do NOT have a revenue problem. We have a SPENDING problem. Big government, supported by the Democratic majority, comes at a very painful price. And as we continue to float Bonds to balalnce our budget who do you think will be paying them off? Not me; but my grandkids and yours. Does that make you feel better?</p>
<p>Throwing more money at education is not the answer. Perhaps you might question how much of the money actually finds it way down to the teachers. How much are we paying Superintendent&#8217;s of Education all over this state anyway?</p>
<p>Are you saying that 50 percent of Latino&#8217;s in LAUSD are dropping out of school because of Howard Jarvis?</p>
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		<title>By: Andy Favor</title>
		<link>http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2008/06/june-6-marks-the-30th-anniversary-of-prop-13-the-biggest-tax-revolt-in-ca-history/comment-page-1/#comment-58157</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy Favor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 04:21:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orangejuiceblog.com/?p=6885#comment-58157</guid>
		<description>Public Schools, you are dead on correct in regard to getting rid of No Child Left Behind.  My current Bi-Monthly Memo from the Cato Institute mentioned a federal reading program that was implemented as part of NCLB.  It said the government spent $6 Billion dollars on the program and it had no benefit.  Just for reference as to how much money that is, American Idol Gives Back raise $65 Million this year.   I think the Sylvan Reading Centers could have had better results for less money.

Did you ever see that Stossel special where a 4th grade boy could not read?  There was a big intervention meeting of counselors, principles, etc. etc., and they all said that they did not see a problem with this child not reading.  Then Stossel paid for the kid to go to Sylvan and he made huge strides.  It was still sad though because when you delay reading that long, it will be very difficult to ever catch up.  Or so I hear.

If there is demand, I should put on an event and show that episode.  I have it on my DVR.  But I should buy it and put on an event.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Public Schools, you are dead on correct in regard to getting rid of No Child Left Behind.  My current Bi-Monthly Memo from the Cato Institute mentioned a federal reading program that was implemented as part of NCLB.  It said the government spent $6 Billion dollars on the program and it had no benefit.  Just for reference as to how much money that is, American Idol Gives Back raise $65 Million this year.   I think the Sylvan Reading Centers could have had better results for less money.</p>
<p>Did you ever see that Stossel special where a 4th grade boy could not read?  There was a big intervention meeting of counselors, principles, etc. etc., and they all said that they did not see a problem with this child not reading.  Then Stossel paid for the kid to go to Sylvan and he made huge strides.  It was still sad though because when you delay reading that long, it will be very difficult to ever catch up.  Or so I hear.</p>
<p>If there is demand, I should put on an event and show that episode.  I have it on my DVR.  But I should buy it and put on an event.</p>
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		<title>By: Public Schools Suffer</title>
		<link>http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2008/06/june-6-marks-the-30th-anniversary-of-prop-13-the-biggest-tax-revolt-in-ca-history/comment-page-1/#comment-58149</link>
		<dc:creator>Public Schools Suffer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 03:28:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orangejuiceblog.com/?p=6885#comment-58149</guid>
		<description>Yes Andy, taking money out of public schools is exactly what we need.  Private schools are no better than public schools and your drop out rates can be misleading because it doesn&#039;t account for kids that transfer or move.  It&#039;s bogus.

And vouchers will do nothing to deal with the socio-economic issues that cause school drop out rates.  Our kids don&#039;t feel valuable and by separating more have and have-nots this will only worsen the situation.  

Privatizing education is not the answer and the Federal Government needs to get rid of No Child Left Behind.  We do nothing but teach to tests.

There are many good people who serve our communities who went to public schools. The issue has to do with funding going to the wrong priorities and not having the bulk of our money going to the classroom.

It boggles my mind to think that Republicans who so despise Government want so badly to run it, it&#039;s because they are giddy at the idea of privatizing all our vital resources so they can further profit from services that have no business being profit driven, such as HEALTH insurance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes Andy, taking money out of public schools is exactly what we need.  Private schools are no better than public schools and your drop out rates can be misleading because it doesn&#8217;t account for kids that transfer or move.  It&#8217;s bogus.</p>
<p>And vouchers will do nothing to deal with the socio-economic issues that cause school drop out rates.  Our kids don&#8217;t feel valuable and by separating more have and have-nots this will only worsen the situation.  </p>
<p>Privatizing education is not the answer and the Federal Government needs to get rid of No Child Left Behind.  We do nothing but teach to tests.</p>
<p>There are many good people who serve our communities who went to public schools. The issue has to do with funding going to the wrong priorities and not having the bulk of our money going to the classroom.</p>
<p>It boggles my mind to think that Republicans who so despise Government want so badly to run it, it&#8217;s because they are giddy at the idea of privatizing all our vital resources so they can further profit from services that have no business being profit driven, such as HEALTH insurance.</p>
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